June 19, 2013

You Are The GM…..For Andy Marte

August 5, 2008 by 31 Comments

WFNY readers have been playing GM for the Cavaliers since the playoffs ended. Well Tribe fans, the ‘off-season’ has come early for this year’s team. So we want your help. We will take a look at the Indians roster and determine who we should try and trade, who deserves an extension, and who we should simply ‘let it ride’. Jamey Carroll, Shin-Soo Choo, Franklin Gutierrez,  Ryan Garko , Casey Blake and Jhonny Peralta’s fates have been voted on, now it’s time for Marte…

I’d be disappointed if there wasn’t a decent debate about this one. Mostly, I’d be disappointed in the Marte supporters for not showing up…

Contract Information-

Marte is under contract only through this year. He is currently stealing making $391,600 from his big league contract. Andy shouldn’t be eligible for arbitration next season, meaning he would likely make just over $400,000 next season should the Indians bring him back. The Indians have no minor league options left on Marte’s contract.

Stats-

Year

G

AB

R

H

2B

3B

HR

RBI

TB

BB

SO

SB

OBP

SLG

AVG
2006 50 164 20 37 15 1 5 23 69 13 38 0 .287 .421 .226
2007 20 57 3 11 4 0 1 8 18 2 9 0 .233 .316 .193
2008 46 132 12 22 4 0 3 6 35 7 34 1 .214 .265 .167

Start with the positive. Andy Marte is an above average defensive third baseman. Many have argued that he is better than Blake, and while I don’t really agree completely, I’m willing to concede it. Andy has not been able to hit at the big league level. His career batting average is .190, and his career OPS .575. Andy’s .479 OPS on the season ranks him 57th….FOR JUST THIRD BASEMEN!

I understand that Andy’s playing time was a bit sporadic at the beginning of the season. I have no problem with the Indians playing him at third the rest of the year (unless they decide to see what Peralta can do there.) Marte has gotten regular playing time over the last month. Let’s see what he’s done with it- 18 games, 67 AB/15H/3HR/6RBI/5BB/17K/.224 average. Marte continued an alarming trend- he strikes out more than he hits. For his career he has 94 K’s and 78 hits. Captain whiff Franklin Gutierrez has a better K/Hit ratio than Marte. Aside from decent numbers at single and double AA ball, the question I have is what do you see in this guy?

Waiting in the Wings-

The problem for the Indians is that Marte was supposed to be the guy waiting in the wings. He was the third base prospect destined to make a difference. At Buffalo Morgan Ensberg is being out-performed by Aaron Herr, who has hit 11 home runs, while striking out 97 times in 83 games. Akron’s Wes Hodges is the next logical choice for a long term solution, but will he be ready to contribute to the major league team next year? You certainly don’t count on that kind of jump from a player, though it has happened occasionally.

Obviously, any journalistic integrity I had has jumped the shark with this post. I don’t see anything that tells me Marte will end up a solid major league player. Maybe you do. Please enlighten us. Otherwise, it’s time to vote. What say you WFNY readers?  Re-sign or release after this season?

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  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Scott

    I said re-sign, only because I was put on the spot by your opening paragraph. I’ve been stubbornly pulling for Marte all season, and he has let me down big time. Had the Brandon Phillips issue never happened, I’d have no problem giving up on Marte. Not the best reason to keep him around, I know, but I can’t help it…

  • Jeremy

    Why not resign him, Shapiro isn’t going to bring anyone else in. So maybe knowing that the job is his will help him relax the rest of the season and in to spring training, and will allow him to get things figured out.

  • AlexWesterh

    Oh dump this idiot. The only reason he is still around is because of Brandon Philips.

    I saw give him the rest of this year, if he shows no signs of improvement hes gone.

  • Shawn

    Release. If we need a third baseman until Wes Hodges shows up, we could always sign that free-agent from the Dodgers…

  • Dave

    I was really pulling for Marte to turn things around with the departure of Blake, but it doesn’t appear to be happening. Unless he picks things up over the next 2 months, it’s time for him to go.

    I don’t know Ensberg’s contract situation next year, but the most logical move for the long-term may be to give the starting 3B gig to a journeyman veteran to begin the year, with Hodges starting the year at AAA and promoted in mid-to-late May if he adjusts well to AAA. While I don’t know that Hodges is in this class, Braun and Longoria were handled similarly. A move of Peralta to 3B may be an option as well, and might mitigate some risk if Hodges is not ready.

  • cbus

    I’d say keep him, let him start for the first half of next year and see if he can progress because the next thing we need is another brandon phillips, becasue you have to remember Marte hasn’t even had a full sesaon of play at the major league level. Which is pretty much what happened to philips we played him for a 130-145 games between 2 seasons and got rid of him for nothing.

  • cathy

    After what i saw from him last night against the rays i would have to say get rid of him. I’ll save my vote though till after i see him play tonight. Peralta at 3rd? Not if he plays there like he does at SS…

  • Erik

    I wake up everyday hoping Marte will join Borowski in the ranks of “Please God don’t ever wear an Indians jersey again.”

  • http://boozehoundsinc.blogspot.com/ Viper

    I see the potential, but not the effort or execution. I said resign, but only if he starts to show something this year and if it’s a cheap deal. (How could it not be?) I don’t see another option unless they commit to Peralta at third, which so far seems unlikely.

  • K-beezy

    What do we have to lose with him at third next year? The closest thing we have to the “next” third baseman is more than likely a year a way in hodges, and marte will be cheaper and in my opinion, just as productive as any journeyman veteran. I think his bat will improve knowing that he has the job (whether he earned it or not) and he is a solid defender. And last, but not least, I have a hard time seeing this team as a serious threat next year. The offense is in shambles (even if pronk and victor return to form) and the bullpen is horrendous, so giving him some reps doesn’t hurt us at all.

    Give the kid a REAL chance before you feed him to the wolves (or to the reds as a future all-star)

  • LaundroMat

    I think we need to quit with the Brandon Phillips line of thinking. So parting ways with him turned out to look silly for us…that does not mean we should tenaciously hold on to any young highly touted prospect, especially when we’ve given him a chance (and by the time this season is up, I believe we can rightly say that Marte was given a chance). He is simply not good at the Major League level. If we were to ditch him and something happened and he turned into a star on another team, it would be a shock, and not reason for embarrassment on our part. As for what to do with 3B, I agree with Shawn. This team would do nothing but benefit from having Blake back. The one problem is that he may want a longer contract than we’re willing to give (I imagine Shapiro would offer just one year, two maximum).

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/ Rick

    Shapiro is the one that said we will contend next season. If he intends to do so, Marte should NOT be the third baseman. Look, he didn’t even hit well at Buffalo, so what makes us think that he’s suddenly going to become Brandon Philips?

    He hit .285 at high A ball at Myrtle Beach in 2003, and hit .275 with 20 home runs for Richmond in 2005. .275 and 20 is not lighting the triple A world on fire. His 2 years at Buffalo- .261, and .267.

  • kiddicus maximus

    i’m with K-Beezy. If we had a GM that would make a move for a legit 3B, then dump the weight… but at $400K? keep him around, see if he can produce anything before we Brandon Phillips again.

    yes, it is a verb now.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/ Rick

    If it’s about money, I’ll play third for $100,000. There. Can we dump him now?

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Scott

    @ Rick: I’d so draft you in fantasy

  • Chris

    It really pains me to say this, but who cares? Until Dolan sells this team, or Shapiro and his crew learn to evaluate amateur talent, the Tribe will continue to be a farm system for all the big market teams out there. He runs this team without thought of putting quality before attendance, and this business model will never work with a professional sports team. They’ll sign Marte for his 400k, and he’ll probably end up batting his weight at ninth if we’re lucky. Shapiro and Wedge will continue to heap their nonsensical rhetoric upon the fans, which they must presume are stupid by now, and the Indians will have another disappointing year next year.

    /bitter about another lost season
    //end rant

  • draftnik1

    Sigh, I’ve been a big Marte supporter, but it’s time to cut him loose.

    We keep calling out the Brandon Phillips issue, but isn’t Marte closer to the Alex Escobar experience? Multi-tool player with high expectations and a centerpiece in a trade is expected to rule the world, but instead seems to be a marginal player with the inability to lay off pitches. Did you see him last night? I love his swing, but not when it’s lunging across the plate to make contact. Too many bad swings that dont’ seem to be getting better.

    We’ve made Phillips-esque decisions in the past (Church, Ludwick, Guthrie, etc), and we’ll make them in the future. We’ve also made Escobar-esque decisions (guys too many to mention that looked good coming up that the fans salivated over, but real baseball guys knew they sucked). I’m putting Marte in the Escobar class, and if he explodes somewhere else, so be it, I’m willing to take the chance. Move Peralta to 3b, Cab to ss, and Idontcare to 2b.

  • http://buhtros.blogspot.com DP

    I said let him go; since Crisp certainly declined a bunch after we traded him, as long as they keep Shoppach around that deal ended up working out in our favor. I can’t see Marte going somewhere else and catching fire all of a sudden, as when we cut Phillips he looked like he had improved a bunch from the 2003 botched experiment. Not exactly apples and apples, IMHO. I don’t know how it would work out, but Jhonny has played 3B in his minor league career, and I’d much rather give ACab and Barfield extended looks at SS/2B respectively than Marte.

  • Oso

    Dump him and put Jhonny at third. He’s even played it in the bigs his rookie year while Omar was still here. Move ACab to SS, Barfield to 2nd and Victor to 1st. ACab and Barfield have the potential to be another Omar and RobbyA, a dynamic, double-play duo for years to come. That way we’d be solid up the middle with Shops, those two and Grady. Jhonny is like Ripken and ARod, not talent-wise mind you but he’s too tall to be a good shortstop after a certain age. You notice Cal moved to 3rd and I think if ARod had stayed in either Seattle or Texas he eventually would have moved to 3rd anyway. Marte is just another failed experiment and a sign of Shapiro not wanting to pay any free agents big bucks.

  • Tom

    Chris,
    I don’t want to hear your rant. You are a garbage Indians fan who doesn’t know much about running a major league baseball team. Take your crap to cleveland.com forums. Stop with the crybaby stuff and add some productive discussion. That’s why I come to this site. I hope to have civilized discussions with other Cleveland fans. Are you entitled to your opinion? Sure. But it’s way off base.
    Unfortunately every decision that is made by the front office is not going to work out. Do you know how much luck is involved in the game of baseball? I am so sick of the overused “Dolan is cheap” crap. Just because he owns a baseball team does not mean he has unlimited funds to go out and get any player he wants. Dolan and his family LOVE Cleveland and the Indians. They want to win just as much as anyone of this site. We don’t operate in the same revenue market that a Boston, Chicago, NY does. That is just reality. It does not necessarily make him cheap. Look at what Oakland, Minnesota, Cleveland, Florida has been able to do in recent years–make the playoffs on a reasonable/low payroll! They just gave out one of the largest contracts in Indians history to Hafner and look how that has panned out to date. They offered Sabathia 80+ million and he turned it down! He wants 6-7 years on his contract. Take a look at how many of those deals have worked out for teams.. Hampton, Kevin Brown, Zito!!! Zito, Mulder, and Hudson were all the rage 3 years ago. Billy Beane dealt all of them for prospects or other players. All three are either terrible or on the DL for extended time now. You have to be smart in this market and the Indians have one of the most forward-thinking front offices in the game. Sometimes you just have an abnormal down year. Did Shaprio or Dolan go out there and take a bat to Fausto’s hip and put him down 2+ months? Did they tear Vic’s elbow when he wasn’t paying attention? Did they tell Sabathia’s agent to push for $130 million? I think you know the answer. So now its time to re-evaluate. That’s why Rick is posing a question like this. What can we do moving forward…

    Personally, I think that Marte needs two more months starting every day to see what he can do. I wouldn’t necessarily get rid of him in the offseason though…

    By the way, were you bitching about the front office and Shapiro last October when we were up 3-1 games on Boston?

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/ Rick

    Release- 60
    Re-Sign- 23

  • Ricky

    My answer might change if Marte can show he can play but until then release. We have a few things that need to be addressed in Free Agency, mainly 4-5 starter and a closer (which might be impossible to find without breaking the bank in free agency), and if Marte doesn’t pan out which it looks like he doesn’t then maybe Shapiro can find a decent 3B for a one or two year deal, he has played the Free Agency market decently well so maybe he can get it done

  • Don

    I hated to see Casey go–he’s what it’s all about–but I understand it. I would give Marte his chance this year, but that’s it. So we maybe made a mistake with Phillips–it happens. I am in favor of trying Jhonny @ 3rd to see if he could handle it, but would rather peddle him for a closer prospect. Omar spoiled me and I just can’t watch Jhonny there (or at the plate, either. I’ve coached high school kids who have a better idea at the plate). Surely, someone is dying for a shortstop who can hit 25-30 HRS. Shoppach has proven his value–let him start at C, and use Victor at 1st, DH, or backup C. I love Garko, but he’s not putting up corner IF numbers. Throw him into a trade with Jhonny. Harsh, but we’re going nowhere with what we have. Think about it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Joey

    Marte is ubelievably bad, especially for what he was hyped up to be when we got him from ther sox. The guy can not hit anything that is not a fastball, why is he even in the majors? He has 6 RBI!! in well over 100 abs. His OBP is around .200. The guy is a waste of time. If it were up to me, i’d stop wasting time and move Jhonny to 3rd. Of course i doubt Shapiro will do that, so i say give Hodges a shot.

  • Chris

    @ Tom – Name the last first round draft pick by the Indians to pan out. If you come up with someone other than Carston Charles, please let me know. I’m really curious why Shapiro and his crew seem adept at only scouting other teams prospects, and not so much with amateur talent.

    My point, which could have been stated better, was Hodges hopefully will be the answer, but probably not next year. So since we’re most likely looking at 2010 for Hodges, unless the magic baseball fairy unleashes a third base talent no one knows about, we’re probably going to see Marte again, whether we like it or not.

  • Chris

    And I stand by the rest of my statement about Shapiro and Wedge tossing out nonsense like “We were one hit away from something big”, “We hit the ball hard, but it didn’t work out”, etc.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/ Rick

    Release- 70
    Re-Sign- 28

  • Lyon

    Give him the rest of the year. If he doesn’t drastically improve, cut him free. Then we can do what should’ve been done earlier and move Jhonny to 3rd.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com/ Rick

    I’m not opposed to offering Marte a minor league contract after the year is out, and who knows, he might even take it.

  • http://buhtros.blogspot.com DP

    Chris,
    You’re painting with a broad brush on Shapiro’s drafts. Baseball drafts aren’t exactly like football drafts… it generally takes players a few years to get through the system, and it’s a big crap-shoot at the top.
    Look at some of these first rounds: http://baseball.about.com/od/firstrounddraftpicks/a/2001mlbdraft.htm
    http://baseball.about.com/od/firstrounddraftpicks/a/2002mlbdraft.htm
    http://baseball.about.com/od/firstrounddraftpicks/a/2003mlbdraft.htm

    What GMs are out there hitting home runs every year in the first round? Most of these guys have either never made the majors or are fringe players at best. If anything, your own argument cancels you out: Shapiro will have better luck making shrewd trades for established minor leaguers than he will trying to scout and draft talent only.

  • Ben

    Its ashame that the Indians season was such a disappointment. But now is the oppurtunity to see where we went wrong. The major mistake this organization made was basically keeping the same team from a year ago. While most teams try to improve in the offseason the Indians were content with the same group of guys they had last year. Unfortunately this group was unable to repeat its performance. Personally I believe it is too early to make a decision on Marte and the next 2 months will allow his talents to be properly evaluated. Whether or not he is successful is of no importance to me because the Crisp trade got us Shoppach (a very capable starting catcher) and prospects like Marte are a dime a dozen.