While We’re Waiting… Fiesta Bowl Edition
January 6, 2009Cavaliers to Roll Out Another Jersey?
January 6, 2009The Internet is a magical place. While Clevelanders of yester-year had to suffer in a vacuum of sports misery talking about their problems, we have the benefit of communication like the world has never seen before. That sounds like the opening lines of pretty much any paper I wrote in college. Wide sweeping statement that is meant to sound somewhat intriguing while not telling you anything that isn’t completely obvious. I digress. I was tired of living in a tunnel with regards to the supposed front-runner for the Cleveland Browns head coaching job, so WFNY reached out to some Jets bloggers to find out what their thoughts are / were about Mangini over the last three years.
So, we have reached out to The Legend of Cecilio Guante (link fixed) and TheJetsBlog.com to provide the learnin’ that we require. Read below and consider yourself informed.
1. Please tell all the Clevelanders here about yourself and your site with the name that nobody ever wants to type.
The Legend of Cecilio Guante – First off, thanks for the chance to talk to a fan base for whom I have much respect. I’m a 31-year old lifelong fan of the Jets and Mets and all that comes along with such affiliations, but I’ve got nothing on the WFNY disciples.
In terms of the blog, after 20 years of yelling at commentators and writers and calling them morons and the like, I decided why not write my own crap? The Legend of Cecilio Guante name is something of an inside joke and meant to pay homage to a bygone era of sports when things were seemingly simpler. For someone in marketing, it’s clearly the longest, worst, least-marketable URL in sports blogging history. On the blog, I opine on all sports, frequently ranting about the foibles of my squads, and the slow evolution of tackle football towards something more resembling the flag variety.
TheJetsBlog.com – I started TheJetsBlog.com four years ago and have been blogging about the Jets pretty much everyday since. It’s been a fun ride and I’ve really enjoyed it! Since I started, I’ve been asked to write for places like AOL and The New York Times.
2. As a Jets fan who has watched the team very closely for the last few years did you think that Eric Mangini deserved to be fired?
The Legend of Cecilio Guante – This could easily become one of those long, meandering answers that never directly addresses the question, but I’ll spare you. Yes. In the simple sense that this Jets franchise, like every other, talks about going deep in the playoffs and making championship runs. Mangini was not the guy who was going to lead Gang Green to the promised land, at least anytime soon. And after all the free agent money, Favre, the expectations (fair or not), the early success and late-season swoon, there needed to be a fall guy. I think the entire coaching staff was an abomination, but with head honcho responsibilities comes accountability. In the end, he likely had to go.
TheJetsBlog.com – No, at least not this year. Many fans were in favor of it, but I wasn’t. If I was the owner I would have given him one more year. Mangini pulled together a decent staff for a young guy, but his coordinators weren’t well regarded coming in, and are less well regarded now (with the exception of ST guru Mike Westhoff).
Eric was not a fan of the Brett Favre experiment and he was sideswiped by an owner who never really bought into Mangini’s low energy press conferences. If it was up to Mangini, he would play a ball-control offense and tough defense. He’s not a fan of QBs who have no regard for his instructions and throw interceptions time and again.
3. Do you think it is impossible for a team to achieve under his watch in the NFL?
The Legend of Cecilio Guante – Define achievement. Could he jump in and lead the Browns back to 9-7 or 10-6? Absolutely. Is he the face of a franchise for a decade-type guy? Although nobody really is nowadays, I’m of the mind he’s definitely not. Here’s the problem. You get the sense this whole heading coaching thing is a bit over his head at this point. In fairness, the guy’s 37 and the Jets job was really his first major-major coaching gig outside of a year as D-coordinator under Belichick in ’05. The flip side of that coin? It’s hard to be a diehard and accept that your head coach is in any significant way “learning on the job.” Patience is also not a virtue New Yorkers seem to care about.
TheJetsBlog.com – Not at all. In my mind, he’s a competent coach but I think that he needs better coordinators than he had in New York. Even with underacheiving personnel he had success (see 2006) and during his entire run with the Jets, he never lost his players, many played hard for him even during their injury riddled 2007 season.
4. Tell me a few of the worst things about Eric Mangini that we Clevelanders should be thinking about as he sits as the reported frontrunner for the Cleveland coaching job.
TheJetsBlog.com – His press conferences reveal nothing so don’t expect to glean a lot from his sitdowns with the press. He also limits the time that writers can watch practices during the season, which chafed at the press some. His scheme isn’t very savvy in terms of blitzing, so look for a bend-don’t-break style defense … it’s not always fun.
Ironically, for his plodding approach, Eric Mangini can get risky when he should be conservative and conservative when he should be risky. Mangini had players who really liked and respected him on his team, but I think he kept them at arm’s distance intentionally, but it could have worked out for him better if he was a little truer to his own personality than just aping his mentor, Bill Belichick.
Mangini is still learning what it means to be a head coach. I think he has potential, and his on the job training with the Jets could really benefit his next stop.
5. Tell me a few of the best things that Browns fans could expect from Mangini.
The Legend of Cecilio Guante – Fantastically uninformative press conferences and interviews. A skill taught by Master Belichick, in this case the pupil has perhaps even surpassed the teacher. Mangini’s ability to provide absolutely no facts or insight about anything of substance – the upcoming game, previous game, play-calling, injuries, the opponent — in any and all public/press interactions is really quite masterful.
Outside of that, I do think he’s a smart football guy. I’m not sure if that makes him a smart football coach. In fact, so far indications are that it does not. However, drawing on my completely non-existent experience in the front offices of NFL organizations, I think he is a solid talent evaluator and prepares his teams well for what they will see from their opponents. Inspiring them to elevate their play? Not so much…
TheJetsBlog.com – He’s prepared for games, he obsesses about his opponents and tries to come up with gameplans specific to any opponent’s weaknesses. Sometimes this gets a little too “cute” and I wish that he would just line up and take it to his opponents. He’s tirelessly dedicated to his job and to his players. He DEMANDS high character players, he demands they play every down for him, he demands that they practice well, and he’s not afraid to play young guys who he’s seen excel in practice.
6. And now for an unsubstantiated crazy guess… If the Browns were to hire Eric Mangini to coach the team, how do you think he would do? Could he teach Braylon Edwards to hold onto the ball and cure staph infections?
The Legend of Cecilio Guante – This is going to come out wrong, but I think Eric Mangini would do how most have done in Cleveland lately. I think you can sign him up for 3-4 years of seasons that fluctuate in the 6-10 to 10-6 range. In other words, more of the same. I think there are some problems with the Browns that mirror issues in New York with the Jets. There’s talent there, but no true real veteran leadership. But, even more importantly, the team itself lacks an identity.
The 2008 Jets were a perfect example of a team that couldn’t (and wouldn’t) define itself. A head coach needs to put a stamp on his squad and take them in a direction. They need to impose their will, personality, style or whatever and chart out a vision for their team and get people behind it, just like any other leader in any other business. I may be wrong, but I don’t see Mangini being able to do that in Cleveland or anywhere else – at least not anytime soon. But, hey, maybe he knows a thing or two about Staph infections?
TheJetsBlog.com – I don’t know much about the Browns organization, but if Crennel built the base of a 3-4, and if the GM gets him the pieces he needs to finish it off, I think he can be a successful head coach in Cleveland. As a note, the Jets clearly weren’t high on Brady Quinn, as they passed him over for Darrelle Revis after moving up to #14 in the 2007 Draft. Quinn seems like the good soldier type, so watch the interactions between him and Mangini.
And CUT!!!! That’s the sitch, people. Direct from the mouths of two serious Jets bloggers. Much thanks to Cecilio’s Scribe from The Legend of Cecilio Guante and Brian from TheJetsBlog.com for wasting their time talking about their oustered coach.
How are you feeling about Mangini being the leader in the clubhouse now, WFNY’ers?
25 Comments
“He’s not a fan of QBs who have no regard for his instructions and throw interceptions time and again.”
So long Derek Anderson…
“He’s not a fan of QBs who have no regard for his instructions and throw interceptions time and again.”
Bye-bye DA.
Sounds like we’re getting a younger, slightly smarter (and much slimmer) version of Romeo. Great work Randy.
LOL @ Wes – Great minds think alike.
“Sounds like we’re getting a younger, slightly smarter (and much slimmer) version of Romeo.”
I keep telling myself “babysteps….”
Well on a positive note (something I’m trying out for my new years resolution-which is hard) at least both seem pretty confident that Mangini was “prepared” for opponents. That wasn’t exactly something I would frequently say of Romeo. It would be nice to finally see what a gameplan looked like. Other than that though they seem like most of the other disguntled fans from other teams (Cinci for instance) I’ve talked to who were never truly happy with their coach because he wasn’t a constant 10-12 game winner, but hey, who is these days? Half the teams in the playoffs this year weren’t in them last year. That at least has to be something to look forward to right?
“He’s not a fan of QBs who have no regard for his instructions and throw interceptions time and again.”
lol, and they signed Brett Farve
I am slowly trying to get optimism about the very real possibility that Mangini will be the next coach of the browns. I would still rather the browns look away from the NE/ Belichick tree, but the interviews seem somewhat promising. Maybe with kokinis and Mangini on the same page with players that they like and look for they might be successful. The QB situation would be interesting to watch out for at least.
a pretty underwhelming assessment from two discerning observers. This helps to mitigate against the “new coach high” that you always get when your time hires its next leader. Thanks for arranging this informative cross-post – good stuff
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Is the URL wrong?
Who will Mangini’s coordinators be? If Lerner is not asking that question THIS TIME (aka Crennel) in the interviews this will be a total failure. In today’s NFL, the coordinators practically dictate success or failure-partiularly with a young head coach (ie the Steelers kept their coordinators under Tomlin, dittoe the Ravens under Harbaugh with the addition of Cam Cameron).
If the answer AGAIN are first time or inexperienced coordinators (of which I expect it to be…..), why would this guy even be considered? Look closely at what coordinator candidates this guy brings to the table…….
Predictions: Kellen blows out his knee. Brady turns out to be really bad. DA is traded and becomes a pro-bowler. AND…Eric Mangini gets a paper-cut from his clipboard and suffers a debilitating staph infection…leaving former head coach, and current defensive coordinator, Romeo Crennel to step in. In the meantime, three more years of terrible play and personnel decisions, then Lerner sells the team. Go Browns!
@Mark – lol w/ Romeo’s phoenix-like ascension to head coach
@Chris- Yes, we had the wrong URL, thanks! (Fixed now.)
glad that you guys do this more often than not, as its always nice to see things from another perspective.
one of the things that makes WFNY stand out from the rest.
Thanks all, this piece was very well done and informative.
And, it scares the living daylights out of me as a fan. Other than the caveats of “plays younger players when they deserve it” and “appears to be prepared for other teams”, what I read above had six or seven glaringly red flags as to why this would be a bad hire for the Browns.
I just don’t understand it. Fool me once….
I dunno. The Browns have me so turned around at this point, that I don’t know what to get excited or depressed about with them anymore…
With that said, I’m pretty willing to give Mangini a chance if this is where the team is headed (and it sure seems like it is). And while it’s nice to get some insight from NY guys who seemed to be relatively objective about their recently departed head coach…could you even IMAGINE what Browns fans would have said about Belichick to fans of any team looking to hire him after his tenure with the club if there had been blogs back in the 90s? There wouldn’t have been one nice thing we could have found to say about him (though we probably could have said several un-printable things).
I’m not saying that these guys didn’t give an accurate depiction of Mangini, nor am I proclaming him to be the next Hall of Fame head coach…I’m just saying that until he gets here, hires his coaches, gets the kind of players he wants and patrols the sidelines for a few games…we really have no idea what kind of head coach we have on our hands.
Great read. Does WFNY get any such requests when ex-Cleveland athletes go to other teams and become all-stars/win championships?
Just thinking of Mangini when the rumors starting going around. I don’t think I’ve ever heard this guy say a single word or make the headlines for any comments. The only thing he’s got on Crennel is a smaller waist size imo.
Lord, I was about ready to accept this guy as an ok choice, but don’t like what I’m reading. Why can’t this city’s sports teams ever, ever hire a coach or GM who did it successfully, by himself, before he got here? Last one I can think of was Hank Peters, who set the groundwork and prepped the young John Hart. If we start from scratch again, can’t it be with someone whose best demonstrated skill is something other than the ability to interview well?
Oh, wait, Rollie Massimino didn’t work out so hot.
This is terrifying. Even the positive stuff is forced and speculative. It almost makes Marty-ball sound good.
When does spring training start again?
It’s fun to talk about this stuff, but I’m not sure there are many good indications of how a head coach will do with a new team… can anyone prove that wrong? For example, Bill Belicheck had no success at all as the head coach of the Browns, then he goes to New England and becomes a genius? I guess when things click for a coach, they click, and they usually can’t be repeated elsewhere.
[…] Reportedly, Holley has personal ties to Mangini. Alas, those that took the 1/3 odds on Scott Pioli coming to Cleveland appear to have quite the sunk cost. Also, those that said you’ll be selling your tickets come a Mangini hire – especially prior to hiring a GM first – please feel free to contact me at any time. If you need a refresher on Eric, we got you covered. […]
As a massive Jet fan I’d lay the majority of the blame on A) Brett Favre B) Brett Favre and C) Brett Favre.
Play calling to me was the most suspect aspect of the Jets but he’s a defensive guy so I really have no idea how much infulence he has on that. Unlike Legend I acutally was for going for it on 4th and 2 from their own 20, mostly because their defense was terrible.
Anyway, I think he’s a competent and good coach and I think he’ll turn out to be a good coach eventually. The issue is that their defense sucked and he was again a defensive guy. I agree with The Jets Blog in saying he better have a better DC than Bob Sutton who was terrible.
Anyway be fully prepared for boredom. Lots & lots of boredom. Do not turn on any of his press conferences for you will hear no answers. Do not look for a bubbly personality cause he won’t show you it.