May 25, 2013

Cliff Lee: Um… Yeah. You’re Welcome.

August 26, 2009 by 24 Comments

thanks-cleveland-leeT-shirt maven Vince Grzegorek was class enough to pass along this latest gem. 

As Cliff Lee continues to dominate every team that crosses his path, Philadelphia fans are loving every second of it.  At least they’re kind enough to thank us, you know?

The item description even tosses in a few Major League references for good measure. 

Rube and the braintrust scoured the league for an ace. Enter the Tribe, selling off pieces faster than a Rick “Wild Thing” Vaughn fastball. Chief Wahoo has bills to pay, kids to feed. Rumor has it they even had to cancel Roger Dorn Appreciation Night. What a shame.

So welcome to Philly, Cliff. You’re gonna like it here. And oh yeah.Thanks Cleveland.

I’m still waiting for our cards from Milwaukee, LA and Boston.  I long for the day we get to make a shirt thanking another city for helping us win a championship.  Though a Roger Dorn appreciation night doesn’t sound half bad…

–

THANKS CLEVELAND[Philly Phaithful]

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  • Isis

    1.) The real fleece in the Lee trade is that Shapiro made the deal without
    getting Happ. Desperation, pure and simple. Philly held all the cards.
    2.) If I hear or read once more (Terry Pluto, et al) that David Huff has the
    same velocity as Lee………………that statement or anyone who
    continues to make it owns it.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Craig

    Someone give me my DeLorean and Flux Capacitor…

    Dear Phoenix thanks for Shaq and our championship?

  • Boomhauer

    If they weren’t going to get any good prospects for Lee, Hafner’s anchor, err…contract, should have been a requirement of any deal. Those teams can afford the hit.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Craig

    Unless they were talking to an American League team with the benefit of the DH there was no possible way a team was going to take him and his bad contract.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Denny

    I read the SI article about Lee and how great he’s been pitching and it was even talking about how good Benny Francisco has been playing – so let’s not believe all the hyperbole coming out of Skrilladelphia.

    At least they were nice enough to say thanks.

  • Boqueesha McButterpants

    I agree we need a Roger Dorn appreciation night…they could place a copy of Hafner’s contract in all the urinals.

  • Swig

    AL pitchers moving to the NL are historically dominant.

    We’ll never get a ty letter from Boston because they don’t realize Victor played somewhere else before his career started in Boston.

    2 MORE MONTHS!!

  • Big TC

    It would have been better if they made the first “L” and the following two “E”s a different color to highlight why they were thanking us. Get it? “L-E-E”? Nevermind.

  • Doracle

    Isis — I agree that the trade looks pretty bad. I’m willing to give Shapiro the benefit of the doubt, just because he has made some pretty shrewd deals for prospects in the past: Hafner, Crisp, Sizemore, Choo, Cabrera, etc., etc. Given his track record, I think it’s at least possible that Shapiro knows something that we don’t. I can’t figure out what that is though — to me, the “bounty” looks like a future backup catcher, a future utility bat, and two wildcard pitchers who may never amount to anything.

    If the trade looks as bad in two years as it does now, I’ll be the first to say so.

    I also wonder if Dolan might have had a hand in the Lee and Martinez trades. Perhaps he forced Shapiro’s hand, made it clear that the team couldn’t afford the two and that Shapiro should get whatever he could for them? In such a case, Shapiro would have had pretty weak bargaining power. Shapiro has his faults, but he is *ahem* very experienced at rebuilding, and usually able to get good returns on established players. That is why the Phillies trade caught me off-guard.

  • Isis

    Doracle……how do you feel about Shapiro’s drafting and player development, which is the core of a major league franchise? Incredulous that you would give Shapiro the benefit of the doubt…….but that’s up to you. And…….you’ve refrenced the handful of good trades while not even considering the mountain of horrific trades (where do I begin).

  • http://www.zfcomics.com dgriff13

    see, now, I was pondering designing a shirt myself, with my photoshop skills. Take a picture of Lee. Tack a bow on his head and wrap him in ribbon that says “Clearance! Clearance! Clearance!”. Add a gift tag that reads:
    To: Philly Fans
    You’re Welcome!
    From: Tribe “fans”.

    Speaking as someone living in Philly, yes, they love him here. And there’s still no jersey available yet???

    Oh yeah, and he’s gonna be signing at a little hole-in-the-wall sports place in my town soon. Should I bring Indians gear or Phillies gear? I’m curious of the “signing etiquette”…

  • DK

    sigh…this argument always ends the same way with some sort of Shappetti reference and how horrible everyone in professional sports is…

    I for one dont have some wool being pulled over my eyes by anyone, and UNDERSTAND that it is the nature of the business of baseball in small to middle market teams, that you have to continually move and change people…the lack of a cap will do that…

    I absolutely freakin love the fact that the very same people who whined and cried about how horrible this team was at the beginning of the season, but offered absolutely no solution, are the same people who whined and cried about making the trades we did…some people are just constantly negative and offer no alternative ideas, other than they are stupid, they dont know what theyre doing, etc…I love that kind of ignorance…

    “ITS NOT WORKING ITS NOT WORKING YOU GUYS SUCK!!! BUT DONT CHANGE ANYTHING THAT MIGHT HELP THIS TEAM IN THE LONG RUN OTHER THAN THE GUYS I PERSONALLY LIKE…THEN I WILL BE OK WITH IT IF YOU GO OUT AND MORTGAGE THE FUTURE TO GET A SMIDGE BETTER THIS YEAR WITH NOT AN OUNCE OF FORESIGHT BECAUSE I EXPECT EVERYTHING TO BE PERFECT IN MY LITTLE WORLD OF DESPAIR!!!!”

    *sigh*

    …because its SO easy to run a professional sports franchise…everyone can do it…duh…

  • Omega King

    I’m with Isis – the Lee trade was the worst of all of them this year, period.

  • MrCleaveland

    Ol’ Cholly Manuel hasn’t stopped smiling for the past month.

  • DK

    Cliff Lee Scouting report

    Fastball (88-92 mph)

    Movement: will show cut action over the plate and to gloveside; uses a two-seam fastball with small sink to armside.
    Command: shows plus command to both sides of the plate; it is his best asset; uses this pitch inside off the plate to right-handed hitters

    David Huff

    Huff is in the upper echelon of left-handed starting pitchers in the minors, and has good potential as a middle of the rotation starter in the big leagues. He throws a fastball, curveball, slider and changeup, with the fastball velocity consistently clocking in at 90-93 MPH and has topped out as high as 94 MPH.

  • Doracle

    Isis –

    Oh, I think that the drafting has been absolutely atrocious since Shapiro took over the team. When I said that “he has his flaws,” this is one of the things that I meant. He also has been a very poor judge of veteran talent, and most of his terrible trades and free agent signings have reflected this. The Dellucci contract was awful, the Micheals trade was awful, signing Kerry Wood to a potentially three-year deal is starting to look like a bad move. His first major trade, involving Matt Lawton, was also pretty terrible (though it’s not like Robby Alomar tore it up as a Met, either). There are other examples, I am sure.

    So yes, I think that Shapiro has made plenty of mistakes. I also think that his biggest mistake has been retaining Wedge, and giving him so much leeway in personnel decisions (I’m thinking of Brandon Phillips, in particular).

    That said, more often than not Wedge has gotten the better of other GMs when he has been trading veterans for prospects. Like I said, the Lee trade looks like it pretty much sucks. If it still looks that way in two years, I will be the first to admit it.

    Perhaps “benefit of the doubt” is too strong a word. Let’s just say that I’m reserving judgment on the trade until enough time has passed that we can get a decent read on it. And for the record, I still think that Dolan might have been pulling the strings.

  • DK

    I also agree that drafting has been pretty bad as well…but for all the guys that you think are going to be dominant, there are 10 more that dont pan out…its a crapshoot, but yes, they havent had much success…

    that being said, I do like the kids we got for who we gave up…I still maintain that it will end up working out, but as was said when we gave up Colon, you have to wait and see…obviously when you give up a major league player and get anything other than that exact same quality player back, getting prospects doesnt look that good…but you have to wait and see what you’ve got in a year or two…snap judgements like that are the problem with personnel in the first place…you cant accurately judge prospects until they have had a chance..we know Lee is good, but we have to see what happens down the road, much as we did with Sizemore, Lee, and Phillips…everyone thought we got completely hosed on that deal, and lookie now…hmmph…

  • DCBucks

    Yeah, look at all the championships Sizemore, Lee, and Phillips brought us… So there!

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com DP Diesel

    you’ve refrenced the handful of good trades while not even considering the mountain of horrific trades (where do I begin).

    I’m curious where you’ll begin. If it’s a “mountain,” I’m calling you on it to produce the list. List as many “horrific” trades (and, by “horrific,” it HAS TO BE A TRADE WHERE THE INDIANS GAVE UP A BIG PIECE AND GOT NOTHING IN RETURN). I’ll try to list as many trades as I can think of that I would call “good”, and I’m curious if the “mountain of horrific trades” stacks up.

    “Good” Trades:
    1. Colon / Sizemore, Lee, Phillips (obviously)

    2. Diaz, Drese / Hafner, Myette (Hafner by far had more production than any of those other three)

    3. Finley / Crisp (Crisp was solid in the leadoff spot and in CF through 2005 before being traded again; Finley retired)

    4. Perez / Cabrera (Perez has been on Baseball Tonight for multiple years, whereas ACab is blossoming into an every-day shortstop who can hit from both sides of the plate, and is 23)

    5. Broussard / Choo (Broussard is out of MLB; Choo has blossomed into our every-day RF with decent average, power, fielding, and throwing skills)

    6. Blake / Santana (Blake is what he is, and wouldn’t have helped the Tribe long-term, whereas Santana is beginning to look like Victor Martinez at this point in their respective careers)

    7. Sabathia / LaPorta, Brantley, Jackson (we weren’t keeping CC, and LaPorta is beginning to show he belongs in The Show; Brantley has battled injuries in AAA, but is a holy terror on the basepaths, and at 23 should be in the discussion for the Tribe leadoff man of the future in the not-too-distant future)

    8. Gutierrez / Valbuena, Joe Smith (While Gut seems to have taken a step forward, he was never going to be an OFer of the future here. Valbuena looks poised to be the potential 2B of the future, and once healthy Joe Smith has been a serviceable matchup-righty out of the pen – both sides seem to have won here)

    To me, those are all “good” trades. It’s too early to rate either the Lee or Martinez trades, though I admit they don’t look as solid as many of these so far. But, since Shapiro has made so many “HORRIFIC” trades in your words, I’m sure that list will be huge.

  • DK

    BOOM.

    (chances are Isis won’t respond anyways, but for the record, I agree with DP. and by the by, just quickly looking at 5-6 sites when looking for “worst baseball trades”, the only thing that comes up regarding the Indians is the Colon trade…funny)

  • chuck

    Oh yes, Charlie Manual is still laughing!

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  • Jason

    Swig – I couldn’t agree with you more about Boston fans… as one of them told me that Manny Ramirez came up through their farm system (true story), until I reminded him that the (now infamous) Dan Duquette outbid the Tribe prior to the 2002 season.

    dgriff – I say ALWAYS wear your Cleveland gear, no matter where you are. You show your pride now and when the tides turn (and they will) nobody can accuse you of being a fair weather fan.

  • mike

    As a Phils fan, I’m very happy about the trade. But it’s not like Cleveland got a bunch of stiffs. You guys have picked up some very talented young players lately, and I wouldn’t be surprised if some of the under-the-radar guys end up being good players.

    I don’t think anyone expected him to pitch THIS well, though.

  • Mike

    Another Philly fan. I have a pretty good understanding of the Phillies farm system, and you guys got a decent return, albeit one with a lot of risk. Marson and Donald will be solid yet unspectacular players down the road – both will be major leaguers, just maybe not starters, probably not all stars.

    Knapp and Carrasco on the other hand could turn out to be 1-2 in your rotation 3-5 years from now. Carrasco is still oyung and was our #1 prospect for what seemed like eternity. He may have struggled this year in Lehigh Valley in wins and ERA but his other stats that indicate potential were still incredible, including being one of the leaders in AAA in strikeouts and strikeout:walk ratio. With us he was a potential one, in the AL is is definitely a potential 2-3 within a year or 2.

    Knapp could be a #1 down the line very easy. He is comparable to Florida’s Josh Johnson. He has a +++ Fastball and good demeanor. He is definitely a prospect with a decent way to go but his potential is very good. You traded an ace now for a potential ace down the line, a rotation piece next year and potential #2/3 down the line, and two quality bench pieces / potential starters. That is not a bad haul at all. It looks worse only because of the quality of prospects we have right now besides the guys we gave up – if Drabek, Brown and Taylor weren’t there our GM could’ve been vilified for selling the farm, as these four would’ve been 4 of our top 5 prospects.