May 20, 2013

NFL Draft: WFNY Discusses Joe Haden

Since we all have our own opinions on the first round of the NFL Draft, we felt it would be best to give you are own individual thoughts in one post.  It was definitely an exciting night and it is leaving a lot of suspense for tonight’s four picks.  Do enjoy…

Scott - Despite all of my attempts to the contrary, I allowed myself to get my hopes up for Eric Berry falling to the seventh pick.  Of course, of all of the picks that Mel Kiper mocked up for months, one of the three had to be Berry going to Kansas city at fifth overall.  With that said, I was very excited about the potential to add Joe Haden prior to the combine, so I do not fault the Browns one bit for addressing the need of a cornerback.

The pick is safe – something that the Browns needed to do given their penchant for first-round failures over the last decade.  The kid is electric – he’s a playmaker and has an amazing reel of film through his tenure with the Gators.  He fills a huge need and will be starting come September 12th in Tampa Bay.  Given that this is the first Florida Gator to come to the Browns via the first round since Gerard Warren in 2001, I’m confident that that he will also be the best player to make the the trip from Gainsville to Cleveland.

Last season, the Browns wanted to address the offensive line and they drafted the top center in the class.  Last night, they managed to get the player that was the top cornerback on nearly every big board.  Do I still want a free safety to help up top?  Sure, but I’m also a big fan of knowing that this team can now go into a third-and-long without  Brandon McDonald and Hank Poteat being on the field.  Any time you can get rid of this risk, I think you come out a winner.  For what it’s worth, my free safety pick for tonight is USF’s Nate Allen.  The Browns will have to trade into the middle of the second-round to get him, but I know the team is a big fan and he would be starting from day one.  Let’s do this….

Andrew- The Browns had the 7th pick in a 6 player draft. Of course they did. So when picks 1-6 pretty much played out as expected, the Browns were stuck in a bit of a tough spot. Should they trade down a few spots and take Earl Thomas? Do they just go ahead and reach a bit to take Thomas at 7? It’s kind of tough to take the #2 guy at his position with the 7th overall pick. So the Browns settled with the best CB on the board in Joe Haden. I’m not concerned one bit with his 40 time. If you watch this guy compete against elite WRs, he can more than hold his own.

It’s tough when you have your heart set on a guy like Eric Berry. If you find yourself in a situation where you’re not comfortable with your pick at #7, then I wish you would just go ahead and trade up a few spots to get the guy you want. But perhaps Washington wasn’t interested in moving down, I don’t know. All I know is that when we first started thinking about the draft, this kid was someone that many of us wanted the Browns to pick and he was a guy that was projected to go to the Browns. It seems ridiculous to me that one slow time hurt his draft stock so much, and I find it interesting that things have come full circle for Haden and he has ended up in Cleveland after all.

I was initially a little lukewarm on this pick just because with the addition of Sheldon Brown I didn’t feel CB was nearly as dire as safety is on the team. So I still kind of wish the Browns would have traded down to get Earl Thomas. That’s not a knock on Haden, though. Haden has a great mentality and has the skills to shore up the CB position on this team for years to come. It’s a perfectly acceptable pick to me. It’s just a let down in the scope what potential the Browns had in picking safeties….

Rick- I’ve said this before, but it is worth repeating. Evaluating talent is perhaps the hardest job in all of sports. If it was as easy as fans seem to think sometimes then everyone would draft wisely every year. There would be no Tom Brady stories. There would be no busts. General Managers wouldn’t lose their jobs. The Browns needed to address the secondary in this draft. Yes, I too would have liked to get Berry but instead we took a cornerback that our leadership thought was the best in the draft. The safety position will get addressed at some point in the next couple picks I imagine, which along with Haden, and Sheldon Brown will improve our secondary.

The thing I’m hearing about Haden that I like is his ability to come up and support the run. I wouldn’t have guessed him to be ‘the physical corner’ from seeing him last night. He seemed to be swimming in that suit and after the crying incident kind of looked like a wet rag. But if he is as good at coming up to support the run defense that will be a good thing for this team. Perhaps he can bring a toughness to the position that just doesn’t exist there right now. Man our corners suck at tackling. Welcome to Cleveland Haden. Sign your contract. Work hard. We’ll love you for it.

DP- It’s a strange task to try to evaluate a draft pick without being able to really look at it in a vacuum. I know there are lots of folks who might think Haden is a bad pick at 7, but it’s nearly impossible to look at the pick without the “yeah, but” of the fact that Berry was gone. And, it’s important to remember that there were a lot of us that were in the “Berry or Haden” camp up until the point that he ran a slow 40-yard dash time.

I look at it this way: the Browns addressed a position of immense need, and if the only knock on Haden is that he doesn’t run fast in shorts and is a bit undersized, to that I would say I’m OK with having a guy who was a standout in the toughest conference in college football. I’d much rather have that than a “workout warrior” that Todd McShay likes, but that’s just me. I will also echo Rick’s sentiment that we needed some additional physicality at the position, so hopefully Haden can bring that.

Finally, I’ll leave you with a quote from my good friend Lars who joined our Columbus contingent for the draft last night: “The problem I have with the talking heads criticizing the Browns pick is that they don’t offer up who the Browns should have taken instead. It was Berry or bust, so they busted, couldn’t trade out of it, and picked one of the top couple of guys… so seriously, I don’t get the heat that they’re taking. Especially since all the good CBs are pretty much gone now.” I think this pretty much sums it up perfectly from my perspective as well: the Browns made what I think is a safe pick that addresses a need, and though they got shut out of the guy(s) they wanted, they didn’t flip out and pull a Jacksonville. That works for me.

TD: I said this last night and I saw Eric Mangini say the same thing this morning – “you can never have too many corners.” He is correct. As much as I wanted Eric Berry (badly), if he was gone, the best move was to build the corner position with the best corner in the draft, Joe Haden. Remember, every single mock draft you saw before the dreaded Combine had haden to the Browns at #7. Then he went out and ran a slower than expected 40 time, and all of a sudden, years of stellar play at Florida were forgotten.

All that matters to me is what I see on the field when the lights shine brightest. And what I saw was Haden being a true shut down corner at the highest level of the college game – the SEC. While the trade for Sheldon Brown improved the depth at the position, the reality is the Browns needed another young corner who could play right away. Eric Wright is solid, but he is just one man. Brandon McDonald? Yikes. Brown is not getting any younger and while he is a true professional, my belief is that if he were still at the top of his game, he’d still be a Philadelphia Eagle. The Haden pick makes all the sense in the world.

Craig: No sense in repeating a lot of what has already been said, but I will just throw out some names.  Hank Poteat, and Terry Cousin.  The Browns made a good decision even if it doesn’t work out in the end and Haden is a bust.  They picked the number one cornerback available and it was a position of need.  On a team that needed defensive secondary help, you can’t ask for anything more.

  • Stan

    Alright, the Joe Haden pick was definately a solid pick for our team. If Haden comes in and really is the #1 CB in the draft, then we would have Haden and Wright as our CB tandem for the next 6-8 yrs (Wrights 25 so give him til 32ish). I am especially open to selecting Taylor Mays now with our 2nd rnd pick, b/c if we have Wright, Brown, and Haden manning up on the other teams wrs, then Mays can either blitz, cover the TE, or play centerfield and read the qbs eyes (if u go on youtube, u can see him chase down a lobbed pass from the 35 all the way to the endzone and he tips it away). I like Colt McCoy, but finish up our secondary and get two guys (Haden and Mays) who can be physical players on the Browns for the next 10 yrs together (i mean, isnt that wat we’ve done by adding Mack to J.Thomas)…..as always, GO BROWNS!!!

  • Daredent

    Not much to discuss here. Welcome to Cleveland Joe! A much needed pick-up to our secondary :)

  • http://keaneobservation.blogspot.com/ largebill

    His time in the 40 was hurt by wind resistance from his ears. That won’t be an issue during games when he wears a helmet.

    Bruce Campbell for RT in 2nd round.

  • Lloyd Braun

    I like the Haden pick. CB was a big need and Haden was the best one. Also, the shear number of CB’s picked in the first rounds shows how important the position is.

    Looking forward to seeing what rounds 2 and 3 bring.

  • http://www.60bpm.com/ Robbie

    I’m not unhappy with the pick at all.

    Does anyone have any clues or predictions on how easy/difficult it will be to have him signed and in camp on day one? He called in briefly at the end of the Rizzo show and he sounded happy to have been picked by Cleveland. I know that probably won’t have much to do with the business side of things, though.

  • http://www.NoLogoNeeded.com Don_NoLogoNeeded.com

    From Hank Poteat and Terry Cousin to Eric Wright, Sheldon Brown and Joe Haden.

    I’ll take that any day.

  • http://waitingfornextyear BAJ22

    Enjoyed your comments and they are similar to my feelings. I was initially 100% in favor of drafting Haden. Then, after trading for Brown, my hopes for getting Berry intensified and I forgot all about Haden. I felt the Browns addressed their huge need for a corner, so it surprised me (big understatement) to hear Haden’s name announced with the 7th pick. After getting over the initial shock, however, I am feeling very good about this pick.

  • NastyNate

    I said it in the other post, but I’ll reiterate – Mangini still had a lot of say in this draft, and the man did draft Darrelle Revis. Just a thought.

  • S-Dub

    I don’t understand why all these people are suggesting that Sheldon Brown is going to play safety? He has NEVER played any safety in the NFL, and you don’t all the sudden convert CB’s to S in the NFL. It’s a different and more physical game. He will help us as a CB and that’s probably it. We should try to get Mays. Nate Allen played on a USF defense that was pretty terrible and supposedly had all this talent. I don’t see it. I love the Haden pick, when is camp?

  • thebigmack67

    PLEASE DRAFT TAYLOR MAYS IN ROUND TWO…

    We need a safety more than anything else….Please…I’l even take Nate Allen….my god…we can’t start Elam and Adams with Special Teamers like Sorensen as our first back up….Do not be foolish and draft Clausen or McCoy in round two…WE MUST GET A SAFETY!

  • PNR

    What are people’s thoughts on James Walker’s piece on ESPN.com where he says that having Wright or Haden coming off the bench next season seems like an unnecessary surplus when the Browns have so many other needs across the board and that with the way the draft board played out, former Texas safety Earl Thomas would have been a more logical fit in terms of need?

  • thebigmack67

    @11…I called Bruce and told him and coach Sam that last nite…and they both acted like I was an idiot…and they acted like Thomas wasn’t any good cause when I called he was still available at 14…which ironically is exactly where he got drafted…

    I would have much rather had Thomas…but can live with Haden…

    We must have a safety…

  • Cribbage

    Haden’s a solid pick. Even Florio, who I usually can’t stand, said that him and Wright represent the most promising young secondary in the NFL. I have to agree. Sheldon Brown adds depth, and maybe he can work out at safety. He hasn’t played the position, but who knows.

    I think we have some more pressing needs to fill before we take another position in the secondary. WR anyone? Did we trade Abe Elam? He seems to be forgotten in all of this. He wasn’t the greatest, but I thought he was pretty solid.

  • http://twitter.com/nullster nullster

    Was Denny too busy to comment on this pick? I feel like he’d have some perspective being that he’s draft lover numero uno.

  • mike

    Yeah, Haden is a good safe pick. We still need a safety. And I think I would have much rather have had CJ Spiller at 7. I have no problem with teams taking best available (I think that is what every football team should do, regardless of need or money), but wouldn’t Spiller be the best available at 7?

  • bobby

    Heckert always goes best player available no matter need. Sounds good, I wont be upset. I would love to see Mays tho, and the first comment makes a great point. If we have 3 solid CBs, Mays wont be asked to cover and make big plays. He will be asked to lay big hits over the middle, and get to the QB. should be nice to see. Best case scenario- Mays gets by Philly and Browns take him in round 2. then Nate Allen takes a short fall to the start of round 3 and the browns take him. The DBs would be set for a long time. Doubt either of those happen tho… we do live in Cleveland…

  • MattyFos

    I like the idea of drafting Taylor Mays. I think the Browns will address the QB position with the 38th pick. Probably Jimmy Clausen. But Taylor Mays is Taylor-made to be an elite Safety. He has the size and speed combo to be an impact player. He wasn’t asked by Carrol and USC to be a ball-hawking Safety. He was asked to be an enforcer, which he was… Rob Ryan has the ability to mold Taylor Mays into a Pro-Bowl Safety and we wouldn’t have had to waste a top ten pick on a Safety.
    Stan is right on the money with his idea about Mays roaming around the defensive backfield and Haden/Wright/Brown manning up the opposing teams wideouts…
    The team still needs to address the right side of the line and they need to address the wideouts. But there are plenty of talented wideouts in the draft class and as the trend of the past couple of years have shown us, wideouts have been falling. So we may be able to get one of the second round prospects (Tate[not likely], Benn, Gilyard and Williams) in the top of the third round. We’ll address Linebacker and RT/RG in the 3rd/4th.

  • Matt#2

    thebigmack67,

    Assuming safety is their biggest remaining need, I would want them to explore the following:
    1) How much wiggle room, time-wise, do they need for a franchise QB?
    2) How available are serviceable safeties from year to year?
    3) How good of a record do they need next year (can it be sacrificed on training a young QB and not having, yet, a good safety)?

    Do you think that adds up to getting a safety in round 2?

    I truly don’t know enough to answer my questions.

  • DK

    i actually wouldnt mind plugging another couple defensive players with the next couple picks…shoring up the D should be the priority…finding a WR would be more of a concern for me rather than a QB…im thinking that Mike Kafka from Northwestern is worth a flier later in the draft…hes big, smart, and gave the Buckeyes fits when we played em in the Big10…

  • MrCleaveland

    The term “safe pick” has acquired something of a negative connotation. However, when you’re drafting where we are, a safe pick is an absolute must.

  • Josh

    I think this is a bit of a message to Eric Wright…Mangini said something along the lines of “the best guys will get on the field.” Sheldon Brown is going to play, you can bet on that. the #7 pick in the draft is most likely gonna play…so where does that leave Wright?

    I think this is the Brown’s way of telling him to step up his game too. Also, isn’t he up for a new contract in a couple of years? are they covering their bases in case he wants crazy money?

  • Du

    Agree with many…Draft Taylor Mays in the 2nd round. Get Tony Pike or Dan LeFevour in Round 3 and let Holmgren do what he does best.

    Growing up in the 80′s, it was all about the Dawg Pound and that rock solid D. The Browns must get back to this. What better way to do so than by setting your secondary for years to come?

  • Gren

    @ bigmack67. I think the draft will fall that way. McCoy or Clausen, they both could start right away (McCoy obviously will have to adapt to a new offense) but, that’s not what we need. We can get a safety in Round 2 and pick up whatever QB falls in our laps in round 3 (Pike, Lefevour, etc..) and that pick has time to grow in our offense holding a clipboard.

    -I know Todd Mcshay is saying we’re trying to move up to get McCoy but, why ? I really think their worried Mays / Allen will go to the Vikings, and want their pick of the two.

  • Mallalubba

    Even with WRs getting bigger and taller every year, doesn’t Haden’s 5′-10 3/4″ still compare to all the other CBs in the league? Call me naive but I never bought into the Eric Berry hype. I’d have taken Suh in this draft…and that’s about it. I think Colt McCoy is going to be an excellent value pick so long as he goes late. I think everyone else benefited from a horrible draft class.

  • AMC

    Said it last night, I’ll say it again – Haden was a solid pick, and given the position the Browns were in, I’m satisfied with a solid pick in that spot. I agree with all those clamoring for Taylor Mays at this point, but don’t see him slipping past Philly who picks right before us. I think it’s going to be McCoy.

  • http://duntouchable1@yahoo.com Stan

    @16 and @17 …thnx for ur agreement w/ me

    all i gotta say is, a few months ago we had Eric Wright and that was it. Now we have 3, count them, 3 starting corners on our team. Rob Ryan can blitz twice as many times this year, b/c he doesnt have to depend on Brandon MacDonald, and that could result in another yr of increased sacks. If we get Mays in the 2nd, we would now have our CB tandem for 6-8yrs, our Brian Dawkins-like Safety in T.Mays, and Elam (or other FA safeties) to make up a good defensive backfield.

    if any of u guys wanna ever talk football, hit me up (shoot me an email) and i’ll give u my opinions…i wont tell u crazy stuff, i’ll tell u the stuff thats best for our franchise …as always, GO BROWNS!

  • TSR3000

    No No no

    Taylor Mays is not good.

  • http://duntouchable1@yahoo.com Stan

    If he isnt good, then Eric Berry isnt good. IF u think i sound like an idiot, put down ur point of view, n i’ll prove u wrong, lol…email me at duntouchable1@yahoo for stan the mans opinion

    GO BROWNS!

  • DK

    word from NFL Network is that Cleveland is calling and looking to trade up to the first pick in the 2nd round, but no word that it is to select a QB…intriguing…I thought STL would go with a WR A. Benn, but they could go back into the round later and still get him and hork an extra 3rd round pick from the Browns…

  • http://duntouchable1@yahoo.com Stan

    Best case scenario, we trade for the pick right before the eagles and get to #36, and only have to give them like one of our 5ths…it wouldnt cost us much, cuz theyre only movin down 2 spots… then we get Mays! we’ve watched reed and polamalu mess us up for yrs, now lets get our guy.

  • thebigmack67

    @18…I feel we can get a QB in round 3 with one of our 3 3rd round picks that will have just as good a chance at being our franchise QB as drafting Clausen or McCoy would have in round 2….

    They must address the safety position with a playmaker in round two…

    Even if they draft a QB this year, the odds of him getting playing time over Wallace and Del Homme are extremely slim…

    We still have the possibilty of grabbing a playmaker with our 2nd pick…they can’t waste it on a QB…there are no playmakers at safety that are going to be sitting there for us in round 3….

    They can draft the next qb literally at any point…don’t waste the 2nd rounder when we can snag a safety with a chance to be special when our current safeties would not start for more than 5 other NFL teams.

  • Du

    Besides…Chances are we will be drafting in the top 10 again next season. If we don’t get our QB this year, we can draft Jake Locker.

  • Kevin

    Alright, you’ve convinced me…the Haden pick was pretty good. I think part of the disappointment of fans is the fact that the Browns didn’t take an offensive position player (hardly anybody else did either).

    In a perfect world, would I take a safety next? Yes. However, this is not a perfect world…it’s Cleveland, and this team needs a QB bad. Face it…the best teams in the league have great QBs and the object of the game is to SCORE POINTS. Therefore, it’s time to take McCoy.

    A while back I heard someone say that eithe Heckert or Holmgren like to draft a quality QB every year since the success rate is so low. I agree with this concept, and the browns are lucky to have quality QBs available in the second round. If they don’t take a good QB, they are basically saying “Jake Delhomme will be holding the fort down for us for the next 3 years.”

    That is a bad idea. Plus, McCoy literally saved a man from drowning while at Texas. I’m sure he can figuratively save the team from drowning in obscurity.

  • http://twitter.com/mallalubba Mallalubba

    Here’s what I liked to see after the pick: Heckert talking about GM stuff and Mangini talking about coaching stuff. (…and slightly less related Holmgren talking about owner stuff when in press conferences.) No more of this one man show. Even last year with our puppet GM, it seemed like Mangini attempted to talk about everything.
    Whether or not the picks pan out, I’m confident that the organization is finally showing signs of organization.

  • http://duntouchable1@yahoo.com Stan

    Yea im glad we finally have a FO like this… hey, has anyone noticed how Heckert and Holmgren refer to Mangini as ‘Coach’? i think has to prove that they’re not planning on getting rid of him after this yr. Mangini’s a smart guy, and i know alot of ppl hated his guts for not making the sexy pick last yr, but we have JT and Mack on our line for 10yrs, and now hopefully Haden and Wright for yrs to come (and im hoping we go w/ T.Mays)…lets hope if Holmgren says go w/ Colt, he ends of as our Franchise QB soon

  • Matt#2

    @33
    “McCoy literally saved a man from drowning while at Texas.”

    Cool.

  • Matt#2

    thebigmack67
    “that will have just as good a chance at being our franchise QB as drafting Clausen or McCoy would have in round 2″

    To the point.

  • BrianRut4

    the only thing that keeps nagging at me is that Earl Thomas is bigger and faster and can play CB and S. I like Haden, but i cant bring myself be be 100% happy with the pick.

  • http://duntouchable1@yahoo.com Stan

    Well yes, Thomas “can” play CB and S, but his one thing that prolly kept him from being better than Berry was that he really doesnt have a safeties size…So couldnt Haden and Thomas be seen as exactly the same: Haden is a good tackler and istinctive (could play safety), Thomas is agile and instincitive (could play cornerback) …If u dont recall, mnths ago every1 in Cleveland was wanting for Haden (every1 always wants the FO to listen to them, well isnt that what they just did) … as always, GO BROWNS!

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  • Kevin Hignett

    @S-Dub: regarding #9, Rod Woodson transitioned from CB to Safety and I’m pretty sure Ty Law did as well. Sheldon Brown is at a similar place in his career relative to those guys, so you can’t say it doesn’t/won’t happen. You can argue that it’s a bad idea, if you like, but it has happened before.

    However, I agree that they should draft a safety and rotate Wright, Haden, and Brown while keeping Brandon McDonald as far from the field as possible for as long as possible.

  • barry

    the same people who thought berry should be a top 5 pick also thought the same of mays last year suggesting that he should come out early.

    OTOH, pete carroll passed on mays to take earl thomas.

    seems to me that the most plausible take is that berry was similarly overrated.

    let’s face it, the only teams to take safeties that high have fubar-ed mgmt: oakland (courtesy of al davis), dallas (courtesy of jerry jones) the redskins (who’ve actually drafted two and finished 4-12 last season, and buffalo. and the last safety drafted that that was worth (sean taylor) led the redskins to a 24-38 record before he got himself shot (RIP).

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