May 18, 2013

Random Browns Thoughts: Rob Ryan, Wide Receiver, Alex Mack vs. Clay Matthews

January 10, 2011 by 28 Comments

The Browns are desperately searching for their next coach, but I won’t talk about candidates today, because there is nothing new to say.

Instead, I will point out an interesting question that a friend of mine raised yesterday.

When the Browns fired Eric Mangini, many thought that Mike Holmgren had his dream guy all lined up and ready to go.  At least at this early stage, that doesn’t seem to be the case.  The Browns are certainly offensive coordinator-heavy at this point.  One thing is for certain: the Browns will have a new looking offense (to us, anyway) next season.  Even if Brian Daboll hasn’t been given his walking papers yet, you can be sure he won’t be back.

But what about Rob Ryan?

I have an off-the-wall prediction based in nothing but my version of entertainment.  Rob Ryan will get hired by Al Davis and the Raiders. Why stop the cycle of insanity now?  I’ll admit that I have no basis for this what-so-ever, except that I think HBO should definitely load up the “Hard Knocks” cameras and do the only suitable sequel to last year’s train wreck with the New York Jets.

Wide receiver is going to be a position of need this off-season.  How many receivers the Browns choose to pick up is a debate worth having.  I have some names for you to start the process.  Obviously the trade market and draft prospects will come into focus at a later date, but here are some free agents I would be interested in exploring.

  1. Steve Breaston is not expected to be back in Arizona.  Even with a QB carousel in Arizona this year, Breaston caught 47 balls for 718 yards.  Only one TD, but even Larry Fitzgerald only had six touchdowns this season, down from 13 the year prior.  Breaston probably isn’t a true #1 receiver, but he is probably a bit better than your average #2.  Lastly, signing Breaston would prove once and for all that we don’t hate Michigan players once they hit the NFL.
  2. Mike Sims-Walker is not expected to re-sign in Jacksonville.  Sims-Walker is similar to Breaston in that he probably isn’t a true #1 receiver.  Even still, in a down year, he caught seven touchdowns with 43 receptions on 562 yards over 14 games.  Sims-Walker can be explosive though.  He had over 150 yards in one game this season against Dallas, and 105 against San Diego. The prior year, Sims-Walker had three games over 100 yards, two more at 91 yards and one with 81 yards.
  3. Plaxico Burress is expected to be back in the league this year and the Browns have very little to lose.  Why not offer to be the host city for the Plaxico Burress career reclamation project?  You have to think that Plaxico will be determined to prove he can still play and also stay out of trouble.  Of course some outlets have already said the New York Giants could very well give Plaxico a second chance, so this could be a waste of typing.

Everyone I know loved Clay Matthews growing up. He will always be an iconic player in Cleveland and probably the epitome of the word “linebacker” for the rest of my life.  I understand that his legacy increased the consternation when the Browns failed to draft Clay Matthews III who is lighting it up in Green Bay for the Packers.  Still, it seems overly nit-picky to sit around claiming that the Browns “missed” when they selected Alex Mack at 21 with Matthews being picked at 25.

I am a bit tired of it, honestly.  The Browns make enough mistakes, without needing to label clear victories as the opposite.  Alex Mack plays a position that doesn’t provide much glory.  He keeps his name out of our mouths against some of the best nose tackles in the league.  He also managed to keep from fumbling like crazy as he worked with three different QBs for extended periods this season.

Clay Matthews is great, but you don’t need to cut down Alex Mack to say that.  There’s no telling how Clay Matthews III would have looked on the Cleveland Browns.  I tend to agree that he would have looked great, but then again, so does Alex Mack.

So keep hammering away at that second round if you want, but leave Alex Mack alone.

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  • MattyFos

    So Nnamdi Asomugha’s contract was voided. Hopefully we can keep Rob Ryan so we have a chance at signing him.

  • Orange Mike

    The Browns could have drafted Clay Matthews at #21 then drafted Alex Mack in the high 2nd round instead of Brian Robiske. All in all, the players drafted in the Browns various traded slots were Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman and Jeremy Maclin. But yeah, the Browns have a center.

  • Charlie

    @ MattyFos: My thoughts exactly.

  • travis

    Its hard not to do that considering Mack isnt that good,he is a average player.Iv brought up this issue numerous times to friends.Take a look back at that draft and look at how many good D players we passed and missed on for those horrible trades.If i remember right ,because its been awhile its 6-8 i believe. The Packers have 2 of them! Raji and matthews. Defense wins championships..Now im not saying we would be playoff bound or what not but Matthews being that good is NO fluke,im pretty sure he would still be that good ,if not pretty close to being that good here to.I , i think along with most people would rather draft a stud LB/DL that can be a franchise player for 10 plus yrs over a average Center in the 1st round,especially when you can get that center in the 4th or 5th.For me the 2009 draft blunder(s) is up there with draftin mike junkin as draftin goes for the browns

  • 6thCity

    Just a theory… but when Browns interview assistant coaches from other teams and therefore ask for permission, is it made entirely clear that they are interviewing them for the HC position? In other words, any possibility that we may consider hiring one of these candidates as OC?

  • C-Bus Kevin

    Craig,

    The 3 receivers you’ve presented convince me even further that WR’s of this quality can be found in the last rounds of the draft and in free agency. You said it yourself. None of those guys is a true #1 receiver.

    Even though they looked poor last year, I think the current lineup of receivers and tight ends would look much better with a true #1 leading the way. Adding a Breaston or Simms-Walker would not make much difference, and both would end up costing too much when you can probably find the same talent level and production from undrafted free agents.

    And as for Burress…while the Michael Vick reclaimation project has worked out so far for Philly, count me out with Plaxico. While he’s had a few moments in the sun in NY, I wouldn’t consider him a “great” #1 receiver, especially after shooting himself in the leg.

  • MattyFos

    @Travis- You can’t get a great Center in the 4th round. It doesn’t work that way.

    @6thCity- People like Mularkey and Shumur can’t make lateral moves. If they get hired somewhere else it has to be for more power. I hate that, because I want Mornhinweg as OC. But he can’t leave Philly for another OC job unless he’s fired.

    Imagine Haden lining up on Mike Wallace with Asomugha lining up on Hines Ward. Both Corners have speed and love to get involved in the run game. Wallace may be able to outrun Haden, but Haden will destroy him on anything shorter than 15 yards. Hines Ward would be blancketed by Nnamdi. I mean seriously blanketed. Unless Ben roethlisberger throws a perfect pass there is absolutely no way Hines Ward will have any catches in my scenario. Now you play a Cover 1 Man just because of Wallace’s speed. Keep Elam/Ward over the top to help Haden when Wallace goes deep (almost every play). The other safety can either help a linebacker cover Heath Miller or roam free like Ed Reed and Darren Sharper. but I would use TJ Ward to stack the box. Put him on the second level and blitz him all day. Maybe throw in some zone blitzes to throw off Ben Roethlisberger.

    /Dream scenario. I love Nnamdi Asomugha. he is the best Cornerback I’ve seen play since Neon Deion. He’s tons more physical than Primetime was though, and I love him even more for that. If we can manage signing Nnamdi we would automatically have the best secondary in the league and would increase our front 7′s production by him just stepping on the field. We would even be able to play a 46 Bear that Buddy Ryan used to play. When you sure up the outside you can do so much stuff with the front 7. And we all know how much Rob Ryan loves tweaking things on the line.

  • C-Bus Kevin

    To expand on my previous point…

    Bringing on a guy like Simms-Walker would be a lateral move, in my opinion. We already have Simms-Walker on our team…his name is MoMass.

    Simms-Walker only had 70-80 yards more than MoMass, and 40% of his production came in 2 games. Even with a fairly decent QB in Garrard, Simms-Walker managed to disappear for entire games. I say no thank you. We already have guys on the roster that are capable of the Houdini routine.

    Seriously Browns…do the hard work of scouting receivers on college teams that aren’t on TV every week (smaller conferences, Division II and III, etc.), and find guys on the cheap to be your role-players. Then, spend the savings on a true #1 receiver…say, a certain guy named Larry who plays in Arizona?

  • http://footballtailgate.weebly.com FBTG

    Good points travis, as I (one of the FBTG contributors who is a fan of the Browns ) would have loved to see a monster in the middle on the d-line or one of the OLB’s .. but it had to have been the theory of the most important pieces in a draft. Mangini built the Jets foundation with a center (Mangold), Tackle (D’Brickashaw), corner (Revis), and then tried to get the pass rusher in Gholston if I remember correctly … at that point he was a Brett Favre meltdown from hitting the playoffs and solidfying his team. Which, when Rex Ryan came in, added Bart Scott (and a few other pieces to be fair), then grabbed his QB and a few wide receivers … and they are a solid team.

    Not saying Mack was the best pick, but if you want a ball controlling .. power running offense (which seemed to be our mold) then a center is a good pick. Especially if you have the top positions (not in any particular order) as QB, WR1, CB1, LT, C, OLB/DE (either pass rusher) …

  • Dude Bro Guy

    Last year’s “train wreck” ? Hard Knocks with the Jets was a home run for HBO. It’s was phenomenal TV, not sure what you were watching.

  • Garry Owen

    @ Dude

    It’s hard to look away from a train wreck. Pretty sure that’s what he meant. It (the Ryan-coached Jets training camp) was a train wreck; thus, you couldn’t look away; thus, great TV.

  • C-Bus Kevin

    @ Garry…maybe that’s why the Browns sell out every year. Some of the last 11 seasons could be viewed as ‘train wrecks’.

  • Garry Owen

    @CBK:

    “Some”? “Could”? I admire your restraint. I’d go with “all” and “must.”

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Craig Lyndall

    Yeah… I didn’t mean “train wreck” as in not compelling. I just meant train wreck in terms of Rex Ryan’s vulgarity, the Jets reporter harassment, etc.

  • http://www.60bpm.com/ Robbie

    I’m curious on the scenario of the Browns passing on Alex Mack in 2009. Isn’t it pretty much accepted that the Steelers were going to grab him if he was available? In that situation, they don’t take Maurice Pouncey (an All-Pro) in the next draft.

  • B-bo

    Rob Ryan leaving would at least make switching to a 4-3 a possibility, so I’m all for it.

    Breaston is the best of the options provided here, in my mind. None are true number ones, and Breaston certainly benefitted from having Fitz lining up on the other side, but Breaston has speed, good hands, and offers a potential threat in the return game as well: as we saw this season, Josh Cribbs is not invincible. Simms-Walker is too fragile for my tastes, and the circus surrounding Plax alone, not to mention the time off for a guy who’s not exactly young, make him unattractive.

    Clay III is a beast, no question. And the nostalgia factor is off the charts. But people treating Mack like some huge mistake are fools. In a division where running the ball against some of the best D-lines and LBs in the game is paramount, a top-flight C is necessary. Robo and MoMass were wasted picks–Mack was not. Play the “what if” game all you want, he filled a need.

  • Omar’s Magic Glove

    If the Browns draft Casey Mathews does that make up for not drafting Clay? Casey is gonna be just as good as his brother, maybe even a bit smarter player. As I understand, he is projected to go in the later rounds of the draft, but his “stock” could go up after a huge game in the national championship.

  • Omar’s Magic Glove

    *Matthews*

  • mgbode

    if the Browns passed on Alex Mack, either the Steelers or Bills would have likely selected him with the other selecting center Eric Wood (who the Bills did take).

    the Browns would have had to go another year with Fraley. I loved Fraley’s demeanor, but the guy wasn’t built to battle Hampton and Ngata 4 times a year.

    I agree. Show Clay III love, but don’t knock Mack to do it (say we should have traded up with those 2 2nd rounders if you must).

  • C-Bus Kevin

    @mgbode…I agree with your idea. It would have been nice to trade up with the second rounders to land more top-flight talent. Then again…maybe it would have been nice to just make better picks with those second rounders.

  • dan

    Mack looks like a good player, but the Browns could have traded down with the Jets, drafted Josh Freeman rather than trade down again, and drafted Pouncey the next year. Or if they had gotten more picks and fewer players from the Jets, well, the possibilities are endless. It still ticks me off that the Browns went from the fifth pick in the draft to the 21st and somehow didn’t end up with a future first round pick. The highest pick the Browns got in the Sanchez trade was the one used to pick David Veikune.

    May I point out that the Browns could have traded down to 19, as they did, and draft Maclin, rather than go down two more spots to get Mack and James Davis, no longer with the team?

    I cant help but think that better dealing would have given us a good center (Mack in 2009 or Pouncey in 2010) AND something else.

  • MattyFos

    @dan
    And that’s why Eric Mangini is looking for a job

  • Believelander

    @2, since you’re apparently in the draft war room for every other nfl franchise, the rumors of the Steelers being hot on Mack were untrue, correct?

    Of course I would also not take a widely scouted ‘nfl ready’ receiver in the second round. Who cares whether he proved to be nfl worthy or not, everyone thought Robiskie was ready to go.

    You guys and your 20/20 hindsight are hilarious.

    @22: if the prez fired the coach for being a bad GM, the prez should be shot.

    No guarantees Clay Matthews would have pulled the kind of weight he has here. I think he would’ve for what it’s worth.

    Of course after losing D’Qwell Jackson for 2 seasons hurt.

    I think I’ll write a list of things that aren’t Eric Mangini’s fault, then crossreference the list of stuff blamed on him. A bunch of hilarious zomg Mangini sux Gruden woot! comments would really make my day.

    Now that we’re scouring all the former head coaching fire-ee coordinators to get our next 2-3 year seatwarmer.

    I’m still waiting for a valid concise argument as to what guy had clearly more potential to win games than the coach we had and why. Vague Eric Mangini insults nonwithstanding, nobody comes up with specific mistakes he makes.

    Oh, some people like to discredit him because of time out management. Of course again, hindsight being clear as it is, that’s easy to say…

  • VooDoo

    I’m a litte late to the party but since the Matthews subject was brought up and I just got finished talking about him last night after the GB v Philly game I thought I’d chime in with my 2 cents. Love the kid, watching him play knowing he could have possibly been in a Browns uniform makes me physically ill. Of course we could say this about alot of guys the past 10 non-Holmgren years.

    As far as those Wrs go if those are the best FA possibilities then pick #6 better be a WR. The only guy on that list who would help would be Breaston but only as a slot/#3 WR. I wanted Anquan Boldin heck I’d have even settled for TJ Whosurmomma heading into this season.

  • bobby

    @23- I agree with you for the most part on just about everything you said. I hate the hindsight 20/20 cause if you were prefect every draft would yield 7 starters and potential All-Pro players each draft. Also, 09 should not be blamed on Mangini. But, I still think there are things that at the time of the decision being made I would have gone different ways in-game with Mangini. You can check the game threads of that. Now, I dont agree everything falls on Mangini, many things were Daboll and Ryan more. The thing I very much so disliked about ‘Frowns article about Mornhinweg was how Mangini (the HC) takes blame for conservative play calling but the OC is blamed for it in Philly? Ultimately, I believe this team should have been at 2-3 wins better easily. Talent, depth, whatever you want to call it, is high enough to have accomplished a .500 record. Maybe its more on Daboll and Ryan, but in the end the blame ends up on the HC fair or not. Do I think Mangini should have been fired? Probably not. But I also cant say he should have stayed.

  • cuzon steve

    just what the browns dont need-another buffoon as head coach

  • dan

    @23, 25:

    In the draft you’re supposed to predict whether a player will be good in the NFL. Pointing out, after the data has come in, that someone wasn’t actually very good at making those predictions isn’t “hindsight”, it’s “evaluating their job performance.”

    Looking, drafting an NFL team isn’t like cleaning out a septic tank, which nobody would do if they weren’t being paid for it. There are plenty of Browns fans who would have gladly done the job in 2009 for free. Kokinis, Mangini, and the scouting staff were paid huge sums of money not because they were the only people willing to do it, but because they were supposed to be skilled at determining which prospective players would make a positive impact on an NFL team. That they did worse then the people who did that job for the Jets, Tampa Bay, and the Eagles, to name just the three the Browns traded with, is an entirely fair criticism. If you can’t evaluate talent selectors based on the talent they’ve selected, you can’t evaluate them at all.

    And #25, why shouldn’t ’09 be blamed on Mangini? Kokinis only got the job because (a) Randy Lerner wanted Mangini so much he hired him before a GM, only to find that no qualified GM would take the job with Mangini in place, and (b) Mangini selected Kokinis. Would Kokinis have got the job without Mangini?

  • http://www.joehunley.com Cleveland Browns Report

    I also believe Rob Ryan will be leaving Cleveland. Ryan has a great deal of desire to become a head coach, therefore I think he will go elsewhere–if not as a head coach, a DC to a team that he feels he will have the opportunity for advancement.