April 18, 2014

While We’re Waiting… Phil Taylor: Cleveland Brown, Plus Tribe News

While We’re Waiting serves as the early morning gathering of WFNY-esque information for your viewing pleasure. Have something you think we should see? Send it to our tips email at tips@waitingfornextyear.com.

“In selecting Baylor’s Phil Taylor, the Browns cash in one of their third-round selections to move up six spots and grab a talented, massive defensive tackle who could form an intimidating interior line core with Ahtyba Rubin Taylor is a massive load weighing anywhere from 340-360 pounds during his time in college

Arriving in the AFC North, Taylor instantly fills a lingering need, as the Browns’ expansion-age struggles in stopping opposing rushing attacks has been well documented The addition of Taylor ideally helps to solve this problem, as well as bandage the team’s needs in finding immediate inside linebacker help” [DK/The OBR]

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“Taylor is a run stuffer and at this he excels. He is an excellent athlete and is well suited to a division that often features the run with the likes of Rashard Mendenhall and Ray Rice. Taylor was likely to be picked in the first round but it seems unlikely that the Browns needed to move up to take Taylor. The pick seemed to leave commentators at the draft at a loss for words. It seems Browns fans will have to repeat their mantra of “in Heckert we trust” and hope that Taylor is a difference maker off the bat next season.” [Dawgs By Nature]

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“Taylor has surprising sideline-to-sideline speed, and he doesn’t get gassed after a 20-yard run. He is excellent at sliding off single blocks and accelerating to the ballcarrier. Flashes decent pass-rush for his size and role; as a three-tech tackle, he can get pretty low and get around a blocker to harass the quarterback. Would seem to transfer well to a role right over center if need be because he engages double-teams and doesn’t lose them – this would be a crucial attribute for a player his size. Good with his hands; has the upper-body strength to push a guard out of the way with a quick slap. Really turned it on at the Senior Bowl and should impress in the agility drills at the scouting combine.” [Shutdown Corner]

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Good news for Tribe fans. Not so good news for Tribe fans.

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A bold move suggested for a first place team?- “Realizing that this is a scenario that I suggested just two weeks ago, the idea that the Indians should keep Cabrera in the lineup into mid-May or so to see if he can right himself has now passed because THIS is who Uncle Orlando is as an MLB player at this point in his career. From 2008 to 2010, The OC posted this line in 444 games:

.277 BA / .319 OBP / .373 SLG / .692 OPS

So far this year, Uncle Orlando has put forth this line in his first 21 games:

.256 BA / .279 OBP / .354 SLG / .633 OPS

Lest you think that Cabrera is suddenly going to improve on his offensive numbers…he won’t. This is who he is and with Phelps absolutely crushing the ball in AAA (.968 OPS) and getting on base at an absurd 46.8% rate that has upped his career AAA OBP to .405, the Indians should remove The OC from the everyday lineup, move him to the Utility IF spot, and call Phelps up to play 2B everyday to give him an extended look in Cleveland before Jason Kipnis and The Chiz arrive to take over 2B and 3B…assuming Phelps and Hannahan are ever willing to concede those positions.” [Cousineau/The DiaTribe]

(AP Photo/Michael Conroy)

  • stin4u

    RE: Taylor

    I hate the move and I hate the fact we gave up a 3rd rounder to move up 6 spots.

    If you’re all in on stock piling picks THEN BE ALL IN ON STOCK PILING PICKS. Don’t give away a viable starter in a 3rd round selection to move up for this guy unless he’s a totally proven commodity *which we can agree he is NOT*. The fact this tweet came out with the rumors that came out about his Jamarcus Russell’ness I am hating it even more.

    There would’ve been better value at 21 or 27 even if this guy was gone. Terrible.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Scott

    Taylor, a first, a second and a fourth is more than ANY player the Browns had on their board when it came to sixth overall. And how can “we” agree that this kid isn’t a starter?

    Browns had Green and Peterson on their board; after that, it was all trade all the time.

  • stin4u

    @Scott – I didn’t say anything about agreeing he is a starter. I’m sure he’ll start.

    But, what I’m saying is, why move six spots unless this guy is the next Warren Sapp? For all I know he could be but to me there were plenty of guys available outside of this guy who would be equal or better in talent.

    To me this is a terrible move based on the fact they gave up a 3rd rounder. I don’t mind the move to 27 but I do mind wasting picks to move up minimally for a borderline player.

  • Lyon

    I agree with Scott. More in favor of this than against.

    Don’t like his money 1st attitude, but let’s give him a chance to show his work ethi/game attitude before we discount him b/c of 1 tweet.

    If I just got picked and was going to be making millions, I’d probably be pretty excited about that too.

  • C-Bus Kevin

    Trades are a complete crapshoot. There’s no way we can know right now if Taylor will be a good pick. I’m willing to see it through.

    In the meantime, I’ll daydream about a run-stopping Browns defense.

  • C-Bus Kevin

    On the money tweets…

    The only reason we know about Taylor’s excitement about getting paid is the fact that twitter exists.

    Of course he wants to get paid, and he just had the best day of his entire life. Let’s not go off the deep end.

  • Harv 21

    Don’t have the warm fuzzies about using a valuable pick to move up and grab a guy who they want to be “Ted Washington Part Deux.” But if he’s a run stuffer with a decent motor like Washington it’s very valuable, just not the sexy pick we anticipated before the trade.

    TODAY is the bigger day for the Browns draft. If they hit on their second and third rounders and we look at the haul as a group we might all be really happy. And we’re set up nicely for next year. If last year’s draft had taken a 24-hour intermission after we took Haden I would not have been as elated as I was after the third round.

  • stin4u

    @Lyon – I get that. And, I fully admit he can be a terrific player. But, to me once you make that trade to move all the way back to 27 for all those picks I think you’re committed to stock piling picks. So to me, burning a third round pick for this guy just did not make sense given that ideal. I’m not Heckert so I have no idea what the process was. Just my opinion.

  • BuckeyeDawg

    I’m not real impressed with his history…started at Penn St. and got kicked off the team before landing at Baylor. “The tweet” is somewhat concerning, but I can’t say I wouldn’t say something similar if I was 22-23 and just found out I was going to be making millions….

    It’s pretty clear that this is who they wanted, so I am assuming that H & H did their due diligence on this guy, and that these issues are able to be overcome. I actually kind of hope he does have an attitude and a bit of a mean streak, as long as he can channel that on to the field.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Scott

    Oh, and it’s worth pointing out that the tweet stuff is complete fallacy. His bio mentioned a desire for money. His current timeline, however:

    “Wanna thank everyone for all the support that you gave me throughout thewhole process!!! love ya”

    “Happy to be a Brown!!!!!”

    “@joehaden23 what’s good bro!! Never thought we’d be on the same team. DMV!!!”

  • Max

    I just dont get it. I hope it works. I do not get paid lots of money to make football decisions, so I will just sit back and hope for the best.

    The top 5 went as badly as it could for Browns fans who wanted a shot at one of the sure fire blue chippers in this draft. Once that happened, options were limited, and trading down made a lot of sense. But so far? I must repeat the mantra that they know more than I do, and I have to hope they are doing the right thing.

    I wonder if Grossi is going to take this regime to task for trading down out of the top 10 to the early 20s to take an interior lineman?

  • http://twitter.com/CTownPride CTownPride

    For the record, there wasn’t an actual tweet about money from him last night or any time recently. It was the description line of his Twitter profile that mentioned getting money. He has since changed it to ready “Happy to be a Cleveland Brown!!!!” He probably had the tagline since he created the Twitter account last year and has since learned or been coached to be more careful with his language.

    His most recent tweets are pretty normal and include a picture of him doing arts and crafts at a children’s hospital. Meanwhile, I’ve sat on my butt watching the NFL draft and commenting on blog posts.

  • stin4u

    RE: The Tweet.

    That was all over WKNR last night. You would’ve thought the guy was wearing shoes made of baby seals while ninja kicking a puppy. I’m glad to hear it wasn’t an actual tweet he put out.

  • Lyon

    Stin… I see where you’re coming from. Obviously we don’t know how any of these picks are going to turn out yet so no one is right. If he turns out to be a Ngata type DT, a 3rd was worth it. If he is Big Money Warren, it wasn’t. Unfortunately we won’t know & we’ll have a differing opinion until then.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Scott

    Can we at least agree that Phil Taylor > Ben Taylor?

  • stin4u

    @Lyon – I fully support that sentiment. And, let me be clear…I think this is less about the player (although there are other guys I liked better), and more about spending an additional pick for minimal gain in value IMO. With so many needs I think you just don’t sacrifice a high middle round pick for just a little gain.

    I’m happy they addressed a need and I am really looking forward to the second round. I just wish they would’ve been a bit more patient.

  • bobby

    I guess I was hearing a lot of misinformation about the money. Still, Heckert had Taylor way ahead of 21, so He got great value in his eyes. Another guy they had great value on was TJ Ward, so while I dont know as much about Phil, I will be optimistic until we see how he plays this season. I hope he fills that hole next to Rubin. Heckert seems to think Jayme Mitchell is coming back too, so theres just 1 more hole and it could be filled by Bowers or Sheard with this 1st pick today.

    Also, if you look at what the browns got overall, they added a 4th this year, moved up from the top 3 to bottom 2 and have a FIRST round pick next year. Great work.

  • BuckeyeDawg

    Glad the tweet rumor is a fallacy. Like I said, I assume H & H did their homework, and that there is nothing to be too concerned about.

    Today is where it gets real interesting. I don’t know how you pass on Bowers if he is still there, even though we have other needs.

  • Tylor

    Great, this isn’t the sexy pick that everybody wanted so they can waste their money on another jersey to throw away three years later. This is a smart/solid move that fills an unbelievably glaring need on the current roster. Please tell me who would start next to Rubin if the season started today? Brian Schaefering?! Please! This guy is a massive run stopper who will come in and start day one. You can’t teach size, he will eat up double teams along with Rubin to open rush/blitz gaps. I for one am very pleased with the pick… Save cash, gain more picks (including 2012 1st), and fill a blinding need.

  • mgbode

    @Scott – “Can we at least agree that Phil Taylor > Ben Taylor?”

    Phil is 2X the man Ben is. Literally.

    In fact, the Browns thought about staying put at #27 to draft Phil Taylor, but Goodell informed the Browns it would take at least 2 picks in order to draft someone of Phil’s stature :)

  • steidman

    This is a response to those critics who always claim that third round picks are crucial. While drafting well in the third year will help a team remain competitive, it is no guarantee they will start or even be back ups. While my research is not thorough and I will definite claim 100% conclusive or intensive, according to ESPN depth charts only Jared Veldheer, OT, OAK, John Jerry, OT, MIA, JD Walton, C, DEN, Colt, QB, Tony Moeaki, TE, Kan were listed as starters. That is 5 out of 37 picks (including compensatory). Far cry that third rounders will start their rookie year.

    There were other player that contributed such as major Wright, CB, CHI, Shipley, WR, CIN, Morgan Burnett, CB, GB and about 7 others and have a decent future.

    There were over 14 players that played marginally, DNP at all and are not even listed on Depth Charts.

    The rest fall between the Shipley’s and marginal or non-existed players.

    conclusion: the third round is still unpredictable. Yes, more research is needed to go back the past 4 yrs to see what 3rd picks are now starters and major contributors. But if H+H believe that someone might snatch Taylor before them, then by all means losing a 3rd pick is not going to cause the browns to miss a key opportunity

  • humboldt

    @Scott – Ben Taylor was a good guy though, really down to earth.

    Let’s play the long game on this draft fellow Browns fans, and judge the full body of Heckert’s work. And can we all agree to shake our mental etch-a-sketch and erase the memory of the faux Twitter post?

  • http://www.adapterdesign.com/ adapterdesign

    I don’t understand the outrage over a kid trying to get money. That’s why everyone goes into pro sports. Spare me the love of the game crap. You can join a rec league if you want that.

    I understand wanting a person that talks a good game about being blessed to play, etc. and I like what Mangini did in regards to getting rid of the egos, but be realistic. Get rid of the egos and the thugs, but if you strip your team of the paper-chasers, you’d have no one left. Money and fame are great motivators to go get broken bones, concussions, loss of long term memory, etc.

    I look forward to seeing Taylor in the orange and brown.

  • Stinkfist

    If Bowers is somehow available, I think we have to take him. In just two picks we could fix that D-Line from completely broken to fairly competitive. Its worth the gamble.