Tribe Bats Blanked By the Bay
June 26, 2011While We’re Waiting… OF Platoon, Carmona’s Mechanics and Hillis is Tough
June 27, 2011Los Angeles Lakers center. Green Bay Packers quarterback. New York Yankees center fielder. Cleveland Cavaliers point guard.
These are all positions that carry with them the weight of decades of legendary figures. Kyrie Irving was taken with the first pick overall this week by the Cleveland Cavaliers. He was instantly compared to recent first pick point guards John Wall and Derrick Rose. He’s apparently not as quick or athletic as those two but a better shooter. Many don’t expect him to as good as those two – Rose is, after all, the MVP.
But let’s slow down for a minute. How will Kyrie stack up against the point guards of Cavalier past?
Are we happy with Mark Price as the ceiling for Kyrie? Or does he have to be a league MVP like Derrick Rose or the Cavs last #1 overall pick? Price is the franchise assists leader and 3 point fgs leader – accumulating these numbers in a career interrupted and shortened by injuries. He led a Cavaliers team that was one of the best in the league – likely NBA champions if not for Michael Jordan. He made four all-star games, including 3 years in a row from ’92-94 during the peak of that team’s run. It will be hard for Irving to be the shooter that Price was, but it is one of his strengths if you believe the scouting reports.
It’s a toss up between the ’90’s Indians and those Cavs for my favorite Cleveland team. Price was the leader on a pretty remarkable and fun team to watch – would it be a disappointment if that’s how it played out for Kyrie when it’s all said and done.
What about Terrell Brandon? I was at the Coliseum for the 1991 Draft party when the Cavs passed on Greg Anthony at 11 and took Brandon, a relative unknown from Oregon. Everyone was in love with the UNLV guys and were confused and angry at Wayne Embry. As soon as Mark Price declined and was traded to Washington, Brandon made the All-Star game in ’96 and ’97. Sports Illustrated labeled him “The Best Point Guard in NBA” during this peak. I realize everything’s relative when comparing eras, but it would be an amazing achievement for Kyrie to be given that title one day.
Reading that SI profile again, I find the upbringing and thoughtful demeanor of Brandon to be comparable to what I’ve seen and heard of Irving. We’ll be lucky if he turns out to have the same attitude as Brandon. Obviously, the one hope is that Irving far exceeds the longevity of Brandon’s success in Cleveland.
Andre Miller was taken 8th overall in the ’99 draft. He was on the all-rookie first team. Within three years, he was averaging a double-double with 16.5 points and nearly 11 assists per game. He’s been a journeyman and bounced around the league playing for 5 different teams. That journey started when the Cavs traded him to the Clippers in the infamous Darius Miles deal. Miller has had success everywhere he’s gone. He’s a good NBA player – you can’t label that pick a bust. The hope is that Irving will be exceed the success Miller enjoyed in Cleveland and, like Brandon, far exceed the time he spent as a Cavalier.
Lastly, the Cavs took John Bagley with the 12th overall pick in the 1982 draft. He lasted in Cleveland for only five years – peaking with an average of 11.7 ppg and 9.4 apg in the ’85-86 season. Bagley is somewhat of a forgotten Cavalier – known more for his success with the Celtics in the early ’90’s. It’s safe to say that Irving’s career would be a major disappointment if it compared to this past first round point guard selection.
I’m not trying to scare Cavs fans into thinking that Irving will be a bust. Some of these guys were really really good. I think it’s a common perception (including mine) that the #1 overall pick has to be an MVP-caliber player and championship driving force, like LeBron or Derrick Rose. It will be wonderful if he achieves that kind of success. It rarely plays out that way. The hope is that it just doesn’t go the way of DaJuan Wagner or Michael Olowokandi or Kwame Brown.
The priority for the Cavaliers is surrounding him with the talent to enjoy success. Andre Miller may not have been as good as Mark Price, but his career in Cleveland would have lasted a lot longer had he played on a team like Price’s.
What do you guys think? Would you be happy if Irving’s career success compares to some of these past Cavs point guards when it’s all said and done?
14 Comments
John Bagley but no Brevin Knight? For shame.
Irving will be a stud, IF he has guys around him. The first big piece to make sure we do that right is Thompson. If Thompson can be everything he has potential to be, than thats a good start. But Irving needs a wing player at his side and a dominant guy in the paint. Loading up with PFs and other PGs won’t help…. You have the cornerstone at Point. Now try and upgrade the wing. Even sign TMac to a one year deal, low risk high reward scenario, until we draft the future scorer next summer
none of the other guys was a number-1 overall pick, so i will be happy (with reagrds to this question in particular) only if he surpasses Mark Price’s status.
Mark Price was good. Really, really good. Only injuries stopped him from being a consistent “best in the league” point guard. I think, to put those kind of expectations on Kyrie Irving is a mistake. We can HOPE he becomes that type of player but to EXPECT it just because he was drafted 1st overall is a too much. The NBA drafts aren’t what they once were. The prospects are just that – prospects. Sure things are much more rare than 10 or 20 years ago. So fellow Cav fans, let’s be patient and not burden the kid with the weight of becoming the Next Great Thing.
Los Angeles Lakers center. Green Bay Packers quarterback. New York Yankees center fielder. Cleveland Cavaliers point guard.
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lmao… no doubt. playground ballers across the country are all vying for that one legendary role.
ALSO:
Though Rose is league MVP, I’m getting the sinking feeling that he’s headed towards becoming a slightly taller, much more athletic version of Allen Iverson. He can’t share the ball; he needs some help in the Chi to be sure, but as it stands I think Irving can potentially have a much better team-wide impact.
Irving has alot to prove for me to replace my Bob Sura jersey.
what about that guy we drafted in the first round who wore #23? No love for John Morton?
Loved Mark Price but sheesh, Cleve fan act like he was the point guard every other team wanted. Was an excellent pure shooter and competitor, but he had significant deficiencies, like weak defense, limited strength to drive in traffic or take a hit without injury. Better point guards then: Magic, Stockton, Isiah, Gary Payton, Mo Cheeks. At least as good offensively-oriented PGs in that era: Kevin Johnson, Rod Strickland, Tim Hardaway.
Very good player who really got the most out of his talent, nice guy, worthy of a kid wearing his jersey, but let’s try to be a little objective when comparing players league-wide.
If there wasn’t MVP talent in the draft (which I argue is the case this year) then the best you can hope for is “very solid NBA player.”
I agree with the drose comparison to Iverson- a little too selfish of a point guard for me. I also think Kyrie could end up being the most balanced and overall complete point guard in the league within a few seasons. But whatever- it doesn’t matter what he is as long as he helps the Cavs become real contenders again.
And Tristan Thompson I’m liking more and more as the fourth pick- what a sidekick he’s gonna be for Kyrie.
Harv – Mark Price essentially produced like Steve Nash when he won those 2 MVPs. I think you are downplaying his contributions.
@Tsunami – cmon now. that’s just crazy.
Mark Price had 7 straight 20+ PER years. That is really, really good. But, Steve Nash was near 24 in his 2 MVP years and had a true shooting percentage @ 65% his 2nd. That is just absolutely ridiculous. Also, Nash’s Asst% and actual assist totals were much more than Price as well. I love Price too, but Nash is possibly the best offensive PG we have ever seen (not to be confused with best overall PG, which he is not).
Now, would Price have had similar #’s if the hand-checking rule was in place? Maybe. But, that is impossible to know as there are too many variables.
(I will say that Price was better offensively than Strickland or Hardaway, but the rest of Harv’s post was fair)
Kyrie can be better than all of those guys, looking forward to a potential All Star guard guiding the way….http://bit.ly/jO77q0