How Will the Steelers React to James Harrison’s Rant?
July 13, 2011While We’re Waiting… Tribe Trade Targets, Manager of the Year and Feel Good Stories
July 14, 2011
“The Itch” has been shelved.
We touched on it earlier today, but the end of the Mitch Talbot era in the rotation didn’t come as we expected. Instead, he was granted a stay of execution
The much maligned right-hander has been placed on the 15-day DL with a lower back strain. Mysterious, considering the fact that Talbot is out of options and has been pitching as if he doesn’t want to be on this roster. Regardless, the lower back problem has flared up at the right time for him and instead of being jettisoned out of the organization, he is placed on the DL.
Taking his place in the rotation will be Jeanmar Gomez, who is expected to start in Talbot’s spot on Sunday in Baltimore. Ezequiel Carrera, the speedy outfielder, has been recalled to take Talbot’s roster spot until Sunday when Gomez will be brought up.
So the long and the short of it: Gomez will become a member of the rotation until a decision is made on Talbot….errrrrr….his back feels better. A spot starter will be needed on Monday as the Indians play two in Minnesota. That will most likely be either David Huff or Zach McAllister, who made his Major League debut last week.
I still will be shocked if Talbot ever makes another start in an Indians uniform. They know what they have in him. Its time to see what a kid with more upside (Gomez) can do in the heat of a pennant race.
31 Comments
I think the ‘lower back strain’ refers to what Manny Acta feels everytime he had to write in Talbot’s name as the starting pitcher.
happy trails Mitch
now we need to work on getting Carerra to stay up. I’ve had enough of Kearns & Duncan in the OF. please at least give me the hope we may steal a base one game.
Is Gomez really a “kid with more upside”? I think Talbot is still the one with the better “stuff”, thus the better upside, but I think his chances of attaining that upside are minute at best since he can’t seem to keep the ball anywhere near the plate, except right down the center of it.
Although hes having a fine season in Columbus, Im not so sure that Gomez is an upgrade. Glad they continue to make moves though because Talbot wasnt cutting it. Any word on when Alex White will be ready? We could use him right about now.
I was fine with even seeing Huff instead of Talbot…if we are not going to get any production out of the spot I say try a left hander…and since we seem hellbent on protecting Pomeranz I say give Huff a chance. I am a firm believer that pitchers only have so many tosses in that arm and a college guy like Drew does not need to spend all that time in the minors.
Ben – Pomeranz will be in Akron within the next few days. I would expect him to finish the season there with an innings cap, open up next season in Columbus and then potentially join the big league team in June. The Chiz pattern, for lack of better term.
Ben – just because you’re going to run out of bullets at some point doesn’t mean you should fire them wildly and all at once. The plan with Pomeranz is a good one. Try to build up that arm to last 200 innings, try to get some significant long-term help out of him, rather than throwing him to the wolves and hoping that he can learn to get big league hitters in his first pro season.
Yeah Pomeranz is still in Kinston, Id like to see him get some time at Akron and at least a few starts in Columbus before we bring him up. Im guessing we will get a look at him next year.
I understand your point on Pomeranz but disagree 100%. Look at Leake for the Reds. If he is one of the 5 best starters why not look at him now. It is not wild to fire your bullets with 5 innings at a time in Cleveland (since we have a great bullpen) as opposed to 7 in Akron or Columbus. I think that the Tribe spends a little too much time with college age kids in the minors. If a kid comes up and can do the job keep him…look at the 2nd base situation…we now know that Phelps was not ready to unseat Orlando…I say give Kipnis a chance now.
I will apologize to the community for mentioning Huff. That was my bad.
I think the trainers need to check Carmona’s lower back too. You sure it doesn’t hurt, Fausto?
Ben, I actualy agree with you on Huff.
I think the next time Fausto is walking around the clubhouse barefoot he better watch out as someone might give him the “braylon” treatment (or should it be called the ‘stallworth’ treatment since he stepped on #17s foot?).
I would like to point out that our ‘lefty-dominated’ lineup will be facing RHP in 10 of the next 11 games and that the one LHP is roller-coaster Liriano.
this would be a good time to run off a winning streak and give us some room to operate down the stretch.
Let me use Adam Miller as an example. He was clearly handled with kid gloves all the way up the system. We have no idea what caused his finger problems…but what if it was a bad mound in Bowie one night in AA that started all of it? Adam Miller should have made that team out of spring training on multiple occasions and was held back for “seasoning” I just think that they take way too much time with some of these kids yet the kids that we trade for from other organizations are ready to go…how many at bats did Asdrubal get in Columbus in 07…maybe 10..
This sounds like Ira Newble getting plantar fasciitis or a swollen knee. #RosterSpot.
Really? Too much time? What about Alex White? Not seeing Pomeranz until next year means too much time?
All I ask is why Pomeranz could not be a September call up or make the club out of spring training. I am not intrested in winning AA or AAA titles. The idea that a college pitcher needs 200+ innings in the minors is absurd. I think that Pomeranz is a Strasburg type talent who should have had a handful of starts at each level and been here by July. Yes I understand that Strasburg blew up his arm but had he been in the Tribe system he would have blown it up in Kinston maybe never to be seen again.
@17
You never know, if Pomeranz dominates AA and the Tribe falls out of the race, I dont think a September call up is out of the realm. Im sure the plan is to handle him as cautiously as possible, but some dominant performances at Akron could speed up the process.
The good news is that no matter what happens this is a wonderful thing to argue about.
I like a rotation next year with Masterson, Tomlin, Carrasco, White, and Pomeranz. If Carmona can find it for a few starts in a row I would be happy to move him and try to find a young OF
(heads to milb.com and looks at seattle minor league outfielders)
Calling up Pomeranz (any of our young prospects really) will be based less on his actual performance and more on arbitration clocks and competitive cycles and other modern era business gobbledegok. Sucks, but I can’t fault the Tribe for trying to make sure that his time in the majors coincide with his peak years.
@NJ: you mean his time as an Indians-controlled asset in the Majors 🙂
But yes, there’s no rush to call up Drew Pomeranz right now from A (that’s 1 ‘A’), to pitch against big leaguers. Starting pitchers need time to develop, build up, and also importantly, if we give him a spot start to ‘test the waters’ with him, assuming he does what rookie pitchers generally do and fails to blow away everyone, we have to burn an option to, well, option him back to the minors.
Ben – a lot of responses here, I’ll try to hit most of them. Leake=/= Pomeranz. Huge differences here. Leake was never considered a guy with anywhere near the ceiling that Pomeranz has, and he was much closer to the majors. That he can make the jump to a below average major leaguer has no bearing on what it will take for Pomeranz to reach his potential.
Second, that you’re ready to write off Phelps says it all. A week or so of action does not tell us anything about anything. We have to be patient with these guys. You don’t become a star overnight. You have to do a lot of work with these kids to develop them.
You better have a lot more than ‘maybe it was a bad mound in Bowie’ to talk about Adam Miller.
Asdrubal Cabrera had 500 PAs in AAA before he made the majors. Then he needed another 150 in the minors the next year anyway.
You’re really going to compare Pomeranz to one of the biggest pitching prospects of all time? I mean, you’ve shown a willful ignorance towards research here, but this is a new low. The number of guys who were a “Strasburg-type” in the history of the game is incredibly low.
Everybody loves the ‘we should have called up this prospect sooner’ argument, because there is no evidence they can be proven wrong. But there’s no evidence to prove me wrong if I want to say “the sun will not come up tomorrow morning” either. We have to be rational about this. Just because a kid dominates at Kinston doesn’t mean hes ready to get major league hitters out. Just because he might be better than Talbot (and even that is not a guarantee!) doesn’t mean its in the best interest of the club to go Dusty Baker on him. The Indians have a chance to turn Pomeranz into a front of the rotation, maybe even #1-type-ace, starting pitcher. I’m all for them trying to do that instead of praying that a kid in his first ever pro season is capable of pitching well enough to make a substantial difference.
@ Vengefull Pat:
“I think Talbot is still the one with the better “stuff”, thus the better upside, but I think his chances of attaining that upside are minute at best since he can’t seem to keep the ball anywhere near the plate, except right down the center of it.”
Doesn’t that statement kind of contradict itself?
Steve:
The Leake/Pomernaz comparison is nothing more than how different organizations have different timelines. I think the Tribe takes way too much time with college age players.
I never said anywhere that I was ready to write off Phelps. They took a shot and he was not ready. If you have to burn another option so be it.
You are kind of making my point with Asdrubal because those 500 AAA at bats were in the Seattle system because he basically skipped AA there. When he got to the Tribe and went back to AAA it was kind of like Phelps who actually needed more time.
Am I comparing Pomeranz to Strasburg? You bet I am. Strasburg is a great prospect but I am willing to bet Pomeranz has a better career. To call that willful ignorance is laughable at best. If you think that Strasburg will have a better career good for you but I would not exactly call you ignorant for that opinion.
Please stop with the Dusty Baker nonsense. No one is advocating a kid comes up here and throws 125 pitches every 5 days for 6 months.
I hope Carrera stays up and Kearns/Duncan gets DFA’d to make room for the pitcher.
I hope Huff doesn’t get called up again. We have seen enough to know that he’s not a Major League starter. What they should do is sell high to some desperate team that will be fooled by his AAA stats this season. (And pray that he is Jeremy Sowers and not Jeremy Guthrie)
why all the love for Jeremy Guthrie?
yeah, he’s turned out better than we thought he would and it’s a testament to his hard work that he’s lasted in the majors this long.
however, he’s still a guy with a 4+ ERA for his career who has less than 6K/9IP and gives up 1.2HR/9IP. He’d be our 4th starter this year.
now, let’s go out today and destroy him 🙂
Jeremy Guthrie is the perfect example of the Ryan Garko argument. Garko drove in 90 runs in 08 because somebody had do. Guthrie puts up numbers (not great ones) because Baltimore has to run him out every 5 days. Let’s knock him out early and let Masterson coast for a change.
@Ben – you are being nice. I was going to say that Guthrie is Baltimore’s Carmona (one great stretch years ago and the fact that the O’s don’t have anyone better to say is their #1 pitcher makes their fans/media pump him up more than they should)
Yeah Guthrie is Baltimore’s Carmona, I agree. Talented, but also a total tease who has never been a consistent winner. 41-60 lifetime record with an ERA of 4.16
Ben – you are way oversimplifying the Leake/Pomeranz comparison. It was well known that Leake would be a fast-riser, but that he would be what he is – a a back of the rotation guy. Pomeranz came with great upside but a noticeable, yet fixable, flag. He had trouble repeating his delivery which led to command issues and his changeup has been a work in progress. Pomeranz is the opposite of a guy you should rush to the majors. The flaws that prevent him from being a #1 type are pretty low on the ‘difficulty to fix’ scale when it comes to pitchers.
Not sure you understand how options work. Phelps was optioned to the minors when he first got put on the 40 man. Either way, the short time he was up here was not useful in any way of evaluating him.
If you aren’t moving the goalposts on the Cabrera argument then I have no idea what you’re trying to say. Cabrera got 233 of his 661 PAs in the Seattle system.
There really is no defense for the ‘Pomeranz is a Strasburg-type talent” argument. He may have a better career now that Strasburg had TJ and pitchers are a huge crapshoot anyway, but thats a different argument. Getting back to Leake/Pomeranz, it was widely accepted that Strasburg had the best of both worlds. He not only had the huge upside but he had pretty much reached it.
And you can take it easier on him, but if you’re calling Pomeranz up, its because you want to win as many games as you can this year, future years be damned. Either use the kid gloves appropriately or not at all.
Steve: I may be oversimplyifing things but you are way overthinking them.
I enjoy your opinion I just have no idea what you are talking about with Asdrubal. He had well over 1000PAs as he was rushed thru the Seattle system.
The repeat your delivery stuff gets way too much attention. As long as it is not causing arm strain you kind of have to deal with it. Look at the problems that Masterson and Carmona have at the majors repeating a delivery…granted Masterson usually fixes it mid-game.
If Pomeranz has such wild control and delivery problems that need time explain the numbers…77IP 32BB…That is not the line of someone who has problems with a delivery or locating pitches.
We can agree to disagree…at this point we should be discussing what in the world we can do at 2B the rest of this year instead of worrying about our future ace in Akron. I also just came to the realization that I am the head of the Pomeranz fan club or one of his family members so I am going to stop.