May 16, 2012

If it is Brad Childress For the Browns, Then Good

Mike Sherman is poised to be the offensive coordinator for the Dolphins and it looks as if the Browns will get Brad Childress, according to sources and reports that peppered social media last night.  Whether or not that means Childress was the consolation prize between the two remains to be seen, but it sure feels that way with Sherman landing first.  The negativity from Browns fans on Brad Childress doesn’t stop there.

If Childress is the guy it will be another Bob LaMonte client coming in to catch a paycheck from Randy Lerner.  LaMonte’s name has grown to such epic proportions over the last two years because he represents so many of the people who occupy Berea, it is becoming its own conspiracy circle.  It would have been funny to see what those theorists would have said if the Browns went after Josh McDaniels who happens to be a Bob LaMonte client, yet a part of the Belichick tree instead of the Holmgren one.  It is my sense that too much is made of the LaMonte thing, but it is certainly a pervasive opinion. 

Childress also flamed out and seemingly lost the locker room in Minnesota as head coach.  It sounds like Childress made a lot of his own problems there in how he got along with the media, but if there is a potentially mitigating circumstance then his name happened to be Randy Moss.  Nobody gets an excuse for losing a locker room as a head coach, but organizations are more likely to keep locker rooms together than individuals.  When you have a front office acquiring guys and then coaches requesting they get ousted, then the message is confusing.

Just ask Eric Mangini. He’s seen it from both sides.  One could argue that Brett Favre was thrust upon him with the New York Jets and when he rode Favre even after he seemed to be imploding the season, Mangini became the fall guy in New York.  On the other side of things, Mangini had players of questionable talent and questionable scheme thrust on him like Jayme Mitchell as he was fighting for his job.  Mangini didn’t play Mitchell and you have to think that philosophical divergence at least had something to do with Mike Holmgren’s decision to cut bait with a guy outside his own tree.  Point being that when they say a coach lost a team, it is usually a whole organization contributing.

Regardless, Childress isn’t being brought here to be the head coach.  You can’t negate him as an offensive coordinator because he might have failed as a head coach.  Last night on Twitter when we were talking about this the examples being used were John Kuester and Romeo Crennel.  It is logical.

If Childress is getting the job and coming here, I’m fine with it.  Childress is a massively experienced candidate with head coaching experience.  I don’t know a lot about his abilities as an offensive coordinator because really, who can separate a coordinator from a strong offensive head coach like Andy Reid?  Childress has experience doing what it seems the Browns want to do offensively.  Whether he will call plays or not remains to be seen, but you have to hope the influx of experience will have benefits for whoever ends up playing this season.  That being said, nothing is a given.  Childress will have a lot to prove just as the rest of the Browns offense will have a lot to prove.

This was the structure I wanted when we found out that the Browns had hired Pat Shurmur.  Surround the young, first-timer with experienced coordinators who’ve seen lots and lots of football.  That didn’t happen last year and even if I can’t tell you with any confidence level that this will work, I can tell you that I think this is 100% the way this coaching staff should have been structured a year ago.

Better late than never, right?

  • 5KMD

    Weel, the Bucs just hired a college coach without any NFL experience so you never know.

  • Anonymous

    But didn’t the Browns hire Holmgren because of his record and accomplishments?  And didn’t they want him because they thought he could instill a system that reflected and built upon this success?  It’s quite possible – I think probable – that the intent all along was for Holmgren to create a team that branched off of his system and tree.  After all, the Browns hired him because he was “Mike Holmgren,” not because he was just some random genius that could evaluate and bring the best football talent.

    It might not be the best strategy, but I think it’s the strategy that the Browns settled on – which was reflected in the decision and approval to fire Mangini (which I certainly hated).  I think your criticism is more appropriately directed toward this overall strategy – which is definitely fair – than toward the means by which Holmgren and the Browns pursue the strategy.  After all, the means (using only WCO guys from Holmgren’s tree) is an obvious and necessary outcropping of the strategy (building a successful team based off of Holmgren’s success).

    [2 cents in a 5 dollar comment]  

  • Anonymous

    one thing to note is that this time last year there sure was alot of talk about the great rookie campaign that Sam Bradford just completed despite so many WRs falling to injuries.

    Shurmur was a surprise, no doubt.  But, it’s not like being the QB-coach in a place where QBs thrived (and fell apart elsewhere) and then getting a whole bunch of pub for making Bradford have a great rookie year meant it was completely off-the-wall crazy either.

  • Hopwin

    I am guardedly neutral (HA!) on this hire. I really only have two naggin concerns and they could both be over nothing:
     
    1) Shurmur used to report to Chilly; how will their relationship work out with the shoe on the other foot? IIRC it didn’t work out too well for Obi Wan and Vader.
    2) How big of a role did Childress play in the Philly offense under Reid? 

  • kjn

    I think a lot of this goes back to the Shurmur hire. Like you said, he doesn’t have the track record you’d expect for a HC hire and, considering his relationship with Holmgren, that started the ball rolling on the cries of cronyism/nepotism. The Lamonte thing is just the frosting on the cake.

    All of which would be fine if we won. I was a big Mangini supporter, yet had no problem with his dismissal because, in the end, he didn’t help his case on the field. How long until we can say that about Shurmur?

    re:Indians/Browns- I think the Browns were $40M under the cap this season, FORTY, yet it’s Dolan who is secretly pocketing millions from all the baseball loving dupes.

  • C-Bus Kevin

    Coaching hires don’t excite me. WINS excite me. If the Browns win more games next year, I don’t care if Craig T. Nelson (straight out of ‘All The Right Moves’) coaches the offense.

  • Anonymous

    we also had the 3rd highest payroll in the uncapped year and it was recently shown that you can carry-over some of your unused cap money year to year (which is crazy to me).

  • Anonymous

    also, according to Florio (I know, I know) we ended up being only $12.8mil under the cap once all the restructuring was done:
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/10/04/updated-cap-numbers-as-of-monday/

  • Ghost

    In my opinion, this is why ex coaches make terrible executives. They are so hell bent on finding guys that have the same philosophies, that they limit their options. Instead of interviewing 10 candidates and hiring the best man for the job, they limit the field to coaches who have run the same schemes and systems that they did when they were coaching.

    Why not hire the best man for the job instead of the best guy who runs the WCO?

    I dont think its ever a good idea to be too narrow minded, coaches are the same way. A lot of these guys are so married to their schemes and their systems that they try to tailor the players to fit the system, rather than tailoring the system to fit the player. If the Browns hire Childress, then what? Will they draft Robert Griffin? Or do they stick with McCoy for another year because they believe hes a better fit for Shurmurs “west coast offense”?

    And if they do draft Griffin, do they tweak the offense to fit his skill set? Or, do they try to jam a square peg into a round hole and make him a “west coast offense” QB?

    The way I see it, the Browns are married to the 1980′s Bill Walsh offense as long as Holmgren is the VP. Maybe it will work, but I cant say that I like their chances.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Craig Lyndall

    He doesn’t flat out stink. He’s inconsistent and best suited as a backup for depth.  

  • kjn

    Ah… good to know. I stand corrected.

    I don’t follow NFL payrollology like I do the MLB equivalent. The one is enough.

  • Anonymous

    I got this info while looking at some headlines on the “LeBron Network” aka ESPN:

    “The problem with Childress is his track record with offenses. In the
    eight years that Childress has been a head coach or offensive
    coordinator in the NFL, his offenses have ranked in the bottom half of
    the league five times.

    The disturbing part is he’s only been an NFL playcaller for one
    season. The result? The Vikings finished 23rd in yards and 26th in
    points (17.6 per game) in 2006 before Childress passed those duties over
    to offensive coordinator Darrell Bevell the next season. Childress
    didn’t call the plays in his three seasons as the Eagles’ offensive
    coordinator (Andy Reid held that role) and he didn’t call the plays in
    his final four seasons with the Vikings.”

    Link is here: http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/41387/childress-isnt-the-answer-for-browns

    Personally I would rather have a more proven commodity like Arians  or even Chudzinski.  Childress had discourse in the locker room while HC in Minny.  Plus can he really call plays?  Will he be like Daboll 2.0 only older?

  • http://twitter.com/SeanInColumbus Sean Pullins

    Yep, and I will be banging the drum with them. LaMonte Industries has had a great run in Cleveland.

  • Anonymous

    So those guys “made McNabb” and it wasn’t the other way around?

    If you say so.

  • Anonymous

    I was thinking of the Craig T. Nelson from the show Coach.

  • Ghost

    I dont see how Childress calling the plays is an upgrade over Shurmur calling the plays, its a lateral move at best in my opinion.

  • Anonymous

    Major Dad.

  • Ghost

    And speaking of Arians, talk about a guy who was unfairly vilified during his time in Cleveland. He did recently retire though so even if Holmgren was open to a change in philosophy he’s not available anyway.

  • Anonymous

    well, every QB who seems to start for Philly seems to have pretty darn good success (except Vince Young).    and, none seem to enjoy that same success once they leave.

    i’d say there’s a pretty good argument for the system over the QB there :)

  • Anonymous

    Whoever’s driving the cart, Holmgren/LaMonte go hand in hand. They plainly don’t like to deal with anyone outside of their club. It’s just basic tribalism. Maybe it works out for them, but there are all kinds of reasons to think it won’t. If you’re not concerned with it, more power to you, but don’t pretend like the folks who are are “weird.”

  • Anonymous

    it’s new and only for 2011/2012 offseasons, so I’m not really all that up on exactly how it works.  basically, as I understand it, you can revert monies backwards in time in addition to forward in time (like a signing bonus has been done in the past).

  • Anonymous

    Michael Vick is one of the most talented athletes to ever play quarterback in the NFL, a number one overall pick. Kevin Kolb had two or three good games against abominable defenses. I don’t know that the argument for the system is really that great.

  • Anonymous

    Yeah I saw he retired.  Shame.

  • Anonymous

    I don’t think any of the questions you posed would be any different (and the answers would be no more clear) if they hired someone outside of the Holmgren tree (or the LaMonte client pool).

    See Eric Mangini. 

  • Anonymous

    Interesting that Jeff Fisher gets hired in St. Louis and his agent is the father of the Rams’ general manager who hired Fisher. But everyone seems to be OK with that.

    But let the Browns hire people who share the same agent and it is some kind of horrible conspiracy to do … something.

  • Anonymous

    “Retire” might have been the Steelers’ best-run-organization-in-football* way of “firing” him. 

    [* Said tongue-in-cheek, but it's actually something I think I believe.  I think.] 

  • Anonymous

    Vick also spent a couple years in jail and never looked like the complete passer that he has in Philly.  QB Ratings were consistently in the 70s in ATL.  QB rating has been 95, 100, 85 in his 3 seasons in Philly. 

    here are some other QBs who flourished in Philly:

    McNabb – though he may have been done when he left
    Jeff Garcia – resurrected him from the QB-dead
    AJ Feeley – Miami gave up a 2nd for him

  • Anonymous

    Yeah, too bad the Browns actually had Chudzinski but he just had to go so they could bring in HoF offensive coordinator Brian Daboll. Who is out of a job again.

  • Anonymous

    How about the Craig T. Nelson from Blades of Glory?

    If we got the Craig T. Nelson from The Incredibles, he could coach and play fullback! 

  • Anonymous

    so, what is the argument that the system in Philly is not good?  Koy Detmer?

  • Anonymous

    The argument is just that QBs like McNabb and Vick can make coaches look better than they are.

    I’m not as enthused by what Feely and Garcia did in Philly as you are.

  • Anonymous

    at this point, there have been many different styles of QBs that have thrived in the WCO.   any coach will tweak it to best fit the players.  that was the whole point of the Walsh philosophy.

    Holmgren himself has been with QBs who have liked the pocket (Montana/Hasselbeck) and those that liked to move around to varying degrees (S.Young/Favre).

  • Anonymous
  • Anonymous
  • Anonymous

    not sure how you can look at what Vick did before Philly and in Philly and not think that the system didn’t have something to do with it.

    Obviously, the better the QB the more advantages you can take out of the system.  No doubt a bad QB in a good system will not be good.

  • Anonymous

    QB rating aside, I believe Vick has won more playoff games as quarterback of the Falcons than he has with  the Eagles.

    Also, doing a bid in Leavenworth might tend to help someone get his priorities in order. We know that there was at least one big distraction he was without by the time he came to play for Philly.

    Anyway, point again is that Vick and McNabb are both sort of once a decade talents.

  • Anonymous

    If it’s just “pretend,” why does it bother you?  That’s weird. 

  • Anonymous

    Really?

  • Anonymous

    what’s funny is that Vick lost to the Eagles both years in ATL (2-2 in playoffs in 5yrs vs. 0-1 in PHI in 2 yrs)

    ok, so you don’t believe coaching has anything to do with it and I do.  agree to disagree.

  • Anonymous

    I certainly didn’t say coaching has nothing to do with it. Anyway, enjoy being so pumped about Chilly. Should be a great weekend.

  • kjn

    One last thing to add: I find it disturbing that Holmgren, who is represented by (and a friend & benefactor of) Lamonte, negotiates with Lamonte on the salaries/contracts of Shurmur, Childress, etc. How is that not a conflict of interests?

  • Anonymous

    Seriously?

  • Floydrubino

    i disagree
    If randy lerner sold franchise and the city of cleveland owned the browns like the packers do i think this would satisfy everyone. Then and finally then people in the front office are actually held accountable for their decisions.

  • http://www.waitingfornextyear.com Craig Lyndall

    Why would you find it disturbing? Concerned about the front office / coaching staff salary cap?

  • Anonymous

    never said I was pumped up about Chilly.  plenty of negative indicators to go along with the positive ones and I have been pointing both out.  just because I think the Philly system is a good one and you think that it’s “once in a decade” type QBs is where we differed.

  • Floydrubino

    There is no conspiracy here. Randy Lerner handed over everything to holmgren because lerner was trying to “show” cleveland he cares. Holmgren is right now sitting behind a $12,000 dollar oak desk eating a dozen donuts and laughing in his mind how good life is to make millions for eating pastries for a living. It all goes back on that randy lerner should not be the caretaker of the browns. He does not deserve it. It is plain and simple. Holmgren hired shurmur who had no head coaching experience at any level. I don’t like childress but at least he has some experience. This is hilarious that instead of us wasting away millions on our failed draft picks that randy lerner will now waste away money on holmgren when heckert should just be in charge. There is no doubt in my mind that tom heckert is very good at what he does and holmgren is just doing things that are unprofessional(hiring friends) and a detriment to the team’s success. Hey thanks holmgren to have a head coach that should now be the 3rd choice on your own staff(at least). Ownership is so important to a team’s success. You just can’t throw money at things and think it will work. You genuinely have to care about it and eat, drink, and sleep it. Randy Lerner would rather have tee time and crumpets with the queen of england then watch any football tapes or analyze coaches and their abilities.

  • kjn

    I find it represents an appalling lack of ethics which reflects poorly on the organization and creates ample opportunity for the type of corruption that would adversely effect the product on the field.

    Am I saying Mike and Bob sit around smoking cigars and drinking cognac while adding extra millions from Lerner’s check book to coaching contracts? Not at all.

    Seriously… how is this hard? You want to know why these conspiracies exist? THIS is an example of why. THIS sort of thing is why you have people saying Lamonte runs the Browns. THIS sort of thing is why people don’t trust Holmgren. But this sort of thing makes this organization look like a joke in many people’s eyes

  • Anonymous

    I just want to see how narrow this will get.

  • kjn

    142-120-0; 5-6-0
    vs.
    0-0-0; 0-0-0

  • Ezzie Goldish

    I agree. I’m not sure why there’s so much complaining about not getting anyone last year – last year was a much better year to assess, and this year to sign long-term guys. (Of course, they still needed more around to assess Colt McCoy…)