On the Cavaliers and the Love of the 3-Point Shot
January 12, 2012WFNY 2012 Draft Not-so-Big Board 1.3
January 12, 2012Another day, another early (premature?) mock draft. This time, from the folks over at Sporting News.
With the fourth-overall selection, the Sporting News feels that the Cleveland Browns will finally use an early draft selection to address the perpetual question mark that has loomed over the head of the quarterback position.
4. Cleveland Browns: Robert Griffin III*, QB, Baylor. Yes, the Browns have a ton of needs, but if they don’t address their quarterback issues, they will continue to lose. Griffin can be the solution; he has a rare combination of athleticism, arm strength, deep passing ability and character.
The jury largely remains hung when it comes to whether the skill set of the one they call “RG3” will mesh well with the system that is still being implemented within the Browns’ offense. The Carolina Panthers and Denver Broncos have done a stellar job in molding their respective offensive units around their unique quarterbacks; could Cleveland be forced to do the same?
[Related: McShay: With the Fourth Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft…]
(Source: Cleveland.com)
38 Comments
I am a proponent of getting Flynn (particularly if he is an UFA).
However, it is important to note: you have far greater odds of getting a franchise QB in the 1st round than anywhere else. however, you can get a franchise QB elsewhere. once the QB starts taking snaps people care more about how he does than where he was drafted (mostly).
best QBs in the NFL right now (not in order):
Rodgers – 1st
Brees – 2nd (1st pick of 2nd)
‘healthy Peyton’ – 1st
Brady – 6th
Rivers – 1st
Eli – 1st
Romo – UDFA
Stafford – 1st
Schaub – 2nd
Ben Roeth – 1st
6 1st round picks out of 10 QBs.even the next level of guys:
Ryan – 1st
Cam – 1st
Alex Smith (this year at least) – 1st
Cutler – 1st
Vick – 1st
all 5 are 1st rounders. I wouldn’t mind taking Alex Smith out of this group. Even if you do that, 10/14 of the top QBs currently in the NFL are 1st round picks.not sure who else to add to this group. I wouldn’t consider Hasselbeck (6th) there anymore and don’t really consider Flacco(1st), Kolb(2nd), Moore(UDFA), Carson Palmer(1st), or Dalton (2nd) in it either.
http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/1/11/2699512/a-look-at-green-bay-qb-matt-flynn-part-iv
Thats a really good breakdown of specific plays from Matt Flynn. Its a 4 part series bu you can skip to the bottom of that link and get the conclusion from the breakdown. Its a Seattle blog page so its to their perspective, but they seem to think Flynn-to-Cleveland is the most likely scenario. I dont know how much I believe it though.
thanks. good breakdown of strengths and weaknesses overall.
I also particularly liked the screenshot of good old friends McDonald and then Wright botching a possible INT.
I sincerely do not think the Browns will draft RG3, and when that happens, with all of the mania stirred up by the media, fans are going to riot. Just my prediction.
I’m definitely in the RG3 camp (right now – it may change the closer to the draft we get). I like the kid’s speed & arm strength. I know it’s a different system than he ran in college, but I think he’ll do well in the NFL. and I hope it’s in the brown & orange.
“Griffin can be the solution”. You gotta love that. Spending the 4th overall pick on a QB who CAN be the solution. You know, if everything breaks just right.
I’m not for or against drafting RG3. I can’t pretend that I am any good whatsoever at projected college QBs for NFL success. I guess I’ll just have to trust the Browns’ scouts. However, the Browns better feel more strongly about RG3 than he “can” be the solution. They better feel 100% he WILL be the solution. If they blow this pick…..ugh, I don’t even want to think about it.
This does a good job of laying out what the opportunity is, what we probably need to additionally take into account is what’s the risk? i.e. going through and listing the QBs who were 1st round picks and turned into garbage, and the ones who were mediocre. If you have a 10% chance of making your 1st round QB pick a franchise guy and a 25% chance of him being servicable that starts to lead you in the direction of a way to act as well.
He’s not a fit for the Browns if they couldn’t figure it out for McCoy I can’t see them doing it for a more dynamic Griffin. Last time I looked football was a team sport and when your missing WRs, RBs (especially if Hillis isn’t resigned) and a RT that doesn’t help. Griffin’s athleticism could get by in college but the NFL is different. Besides that I haven’t seen anything to indicate any coach with the team could utilize Griffin’s talents. If they couldn’t figure out how to best use Josh Cribbs how in the world will they do it with Griffin?
In a perfect world Washington makes an offer the Browns can’t resist this way I don’t have to listen to the whiners that Griffin wasn’t chosen. He might just be an All-Pro Mr. Universe eventually but not in Cleveland. To me he’s not the second coming of Cam Bewton but then again I’ve been wrong before.
I like how Cleveland fans always talk about how certain players can end up being all-pro super awesome, but not in Cleveland. Who could be good in Cleveland?
Someone who has been running a 3 step drop offense all their life and is comfortable and good at it. Shurmur won’t adapt his offense to his players, as we saw over and over and over again.
I sincerely hope the Browns do not draft a QB or running back at #4. I’d think about Blackmon if he was still around, but would love to see them take the best OT available, either Kalil or Reiff.
How can you definitively ever say that someone WILL be the solution? No one ever knows. I am sure every GM that ever picked a QB in the top 10 thought the guy would be the solution.
Well if this prediction comes true, at least we won’t have traded up to get him.
Trading up to get a guy who is not a primary need would be the worst of both worlds.
You don’t just take whatever position you need at #4. Huge drop after Kalil. One could argue the same from Luck to RG3 but the point is you can’t just dig your heels in and say we are taking the best OL regardless of who is left. We need to take the best player at #4 unless he is a LT or a C (it won’t be).
I’m not sure I believe that at all. I think there are plenty of times where GMs make picks based on outside influences that go against their internal instincts.
Point taken. I trust that Heckert won’t be influenced by the fans or media. If that were the case not sure Haden and Taylor would have been the picks (although in retrospect they seem like great choices).
I wonder how many times this will change before April 26th. I may have to ignore all draft talk for the next 2 months.
Besides that, I agree that we need to take the best available at #4. I don’t want to see them lose both first round picks to trade up two spots.
Agree that we should not trade up for anyone not named Luck. Disagree that QB is not a primary need.
i highly recommend the link below for good scouting and easy to understand grading.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/scouting_department.html
per these guys, decastro grades highest for o-linemen then kalil/konz and reiff right behind them. drop-off occurs after these four. (so while i also have read that there’s a huge drop after kalil, there are other opinions on that.)
the grading scale is interesting:
9.0 instantly one of premier players in nfl;
8.5 will become premier player;
8.0 immediate starter, feature player;
7.5 becomes start first year, feature player.
fyi, here’s the sum total of players 7.5 and higher in this draft. they rate only 11 at that grade.
I completely agree. Which is why I’ve decided to just trust the decision they make on RG3. I honestly don’t care either way.
You REALLY think that QB isn’t a primary need? Some of you people are so delusional.
the real question when doing it is where you draw those dividing lines. do a few good years mean you hit, or is that reserved for guys like Peyton and Brady who help you for a decade? how many tiers?
Yes, CNewst, I really think that QB isn’t a primary need. I may not be as brilliant as you, but I think WR, RB, and OL are primary needs and that QB is a secondary need.
One of the nice things about this site is that people can usually engage in debate and express differing opinions without being called “stupid,” “beyond dumb,” and “delusional.”
But not always.
From what I saw I say no it’s not. McCoy isn’t my guy but the kid was fed to the lions out there. I definitely think he could use an OC and work on his pass progressions.
Sounds like we all agree that QB is a need. I would simply argue that our running game was pretty pathetic b/c there was no fear that our passing attack would stretch the field. A lot of that was the play calling, but a lot of that was the lack of solid QB play.
I would just be excited to have a true offensive weapon have the ball every play. I think RG3 could easily run for 600 yards and 5-6 TDs while putting up better passing numbers than Colt.
Im assuming Brandon Jackson will be starting at RB next year, I wonder if his ties to Flynn may play a role
@MrCleaveland:disqus – It’s delusional (“maintaining fixed false beliefs even whenconfronted with facts”). Characterizing your opinion as such is not an insult. It’s just true. Every media person, our head coach, our GM, our president, the writers of this site, every mock draft author I’ve read to date–ALL of them think the QB is a position of PRIMARY need for the Cleveland Browns. Our QB was among the least productive in the league and is incapable of throwing the ball further than 9 yards. QB is (I’m sure you would agree) among the most critical positions in football. QB is (I’m sure you would agree) among the most difficult positions to fill in football. The Browns currently have the resources to address that need and have told everyone (btw the lines) that they plan on doing so.
So, to suggest that QB is not a primary need is, in practical fact, delusional.
Thank you, Jack. I must have been delusional to think I wasn’t delusional.
A slightly below average quarterback can thrive given time in the pocket, a running game, and receivers who don’t drop the ball.
Talented quarterbacks who spend their Sundays on their backs beneath large defensive linemen don’t last long.
Talented quarterbacks who are predictable (lack of a running game) have a particularly difficult time without quality receivers.
Right Tackle
Wide Receiver
Running Back (assuming Hillis leaves)
Assuming Luck goes at number one, that leaves Kalil, Blackmon or Richardson at 4 regardless who goes where at 2 and 3.
And there are heaps of first round QB busts, more so than Hall of Famers.
Build a quality surrounding cast and THEN see about finding that Franchise QB.
How ridiculous to suggest that an elite prospect with all the skills and intelligence you could want can’t adapt to a pro-style or Shurmur style offense.
Fed to the lions? Hardly, most of his problems were of his own doing. Held the ball too long, didn’t lead receivers, waited for the receiver to make his break before throwing. All of that equates to career backup.
Yeah nothing you said there is true or realistic. A slightly below average QB can maybe sneak you into the playoffs. If they have a historically great defense then maybe they go further. Talented QBs don’t spend time on their backs because the get rid of the ball quickly. Manning, Rodgers, Fat Ben, and a host of others all have much worse O lines than we do. Predicatable QBs like Brady, Rodgers and rapistburger have all won superbowls.
Oh the myth of us bending our system to fit RG3. He isn’t Tebow or even Cam Newton, he’s a infinitely superior passer that exhibits touch, accuracy, incredible intelligence and football IQ, combined with track star speed.. It’s a shame people assume he needs to have a system to be “elite” when almost every QB in college plays in some form of the spread and have to make adjustments for pro style offenses. There’s nothing to suggest RG3 can’t make the transition as well or better than anyone before him.
Your plan is the exact opposite of nearly every successful franchise.
Good call.
Why do people say things like, “there are more first round QB busts than Hall of Famers”…um, that’s true of every position…
You realize it takes longer to learn how to play QB in the NFL than it does any other position…right? So why would we want a ‘system’ in place, and then get a QB who is a year or multiple years behind everyone else?
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