“A Win is a Win”
I have heard this phrase uttered a lot over the past 20 hours or so. In all seriousness, do you buy it? I don’t. While Browns head coach Eric Mangini had a Kool-Aid smile working in his postgame chat with the media and used the term “ecstatic” to describe his feelings about a 6-3 win over the hapless Bills, all I can do is shake my head. That was about as pathetic of a win as you could possibly have.
Yes, the monkey is off his back. It was a turbulent week in Berea which had a happy ending, but tell me, what is there to get excited about? Dave Zastudil’s punting? (SIDE NOTE – I have never seen a punter have a better day – three times the Browns special teamers downed Zastudil’s work inside the five, twice at the one.)
I will say the defense was much improved. They actually showed a pass rush most of the day, managed a bend, but don’t break approach in regards to the running game, and held Terrell Owens and Lee Evans to next to nothing on the outside. But how much of that is the improvement on the D and how much of it was that the Bills have perhaps the worst pass blocking line in the league (they had NINE false start penalties. NINE) and a QB who belongs in the UFL? “The experts” can tell me all they want that Bills QB Trent Edwards has a bright future. The guy looks like the second coming of Bubby Brister to me.
Offensively, I know Derek Anderson was an absurd 2-17 passing, but on this windy day, he deserves a mulligan, especially considering the drop passes that killed drives all day long. Memo to Robert Royal – your drop of a sure 30-plus yard gain was worse than Braylon-esque. Even with Jamal Lewis going for 117 yards, how can I get excited about this offense who still only managed six points?
You can call it a defensive struggle and field position battle, I call it two bad teams waging an epic game of who can make the costly mistake first.
That would be Buffalo.
The difference in this game was one single idiotic mistake by the Bills Roscoe Parrish. If he doesn’t fumble the punt deep in his own territory with just under three minutes remaining, I am 100% positive this game would have been a 3-3 tie.
That is the thing; as bad as the Browns appear to be, there are others in this league that may be worse. I cannot get excited about a 6-3 win over another bottom feeder NFL team. I can’t. I can tell you though that the product I saw on the field yesterday throughout the league is as bad as its ever been, yet the sport’s popularity only seems to grow.
The Browns, Rams, Raiders, Chiefs, Lions, Bills, Buccaneers, and Redskins are all complete garbage. That’s a fourth of your league that literally are unwatchable week to week. Carolina and Miami mirror the ‘08 Browns where they certainly can’t live up to the previous year’s success and last place schedule. You’ve seen the Broncos play – they are 5-0? Its mediocre football all over the land every Sunday.
Thank goodness for Fantasy Football.
But I digress.
Don’t get me wrong, I am happy that the Browns actually won a game, because looking forward, there isn’t a winnable game in the bunch until a November 22nd visit to Detroit. But the fact remains that it took a lucky break to get them a 6-3 win against a team that may be worse than they are.
photo by John Kuntz/Plain Dealer
October 12th, 2009 at 2:08 pm
Great article, it is 100% accurate. Throughout the league, I have never seen so much bad football. Dropped passes, a loose ball on every other play (im talking to u especially, knowshon moreno), and how many times have i seen the d-backs in this league tackle high instead of low all friggin year. TD is dead on, football is regressing.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:12 pm
Good piece. Mangini was beaming all day. What is there to smile about? Really? Your QB either throws a great pass or one that is ugly (definitely more of these yesterday), your WRs drenched their hands in butter before the game, in the past 125+ possessions, 2.3% (or so?) of them have scored a TD. Two point three percent. Bah… I digress…
On a side note, anyone see DA’s interception again? Check out Mo-Ma’s reaction. He walks right past the guy, in Braylon-esque style, lets him gets up, and then decides to make a slight attempt to get the guy.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:15 pm
I agree: “A win is a win” does not apply here.
I disagree: DA does not get a mulligan based upon the standard Mangini has set.
We may as well put Cribbs at QB and see what he’s got.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:16 pm
we sat here and debated whether or not last week’s loss was a “good loss” and the overwhelming feedback was “there is no such thing”. If thats the case, then certainly there is no bad win.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:26 pm
The mediocre football is obviously Twitter’s fault.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
Being a Denver resident and a Browns fan, I can’t help but think about how bad the Browns missed so far on Mangini. Watching the way McDaniels has coached his team this year is in a lot of ways similar to what Mangini has done in Cleveland. The difference is, McDaniels has been successful. Think about the parallels:
- Broncos got rid of his “rocket-armed” qb in Cutler for soft tossing Kyle Orton who threw for over 300yds yesterday against NE…but ball control offense is for losers!! Or undefeated teams.
- He had a loud mouth receiver who felt disrespected on his team but has miraculously gotten him to show up on Sundays.
- He also has a defense that last year was pathetic.
- Both are Belly-Boys
Watching McDaniels pump his fists and go nuts for what he and everyone else in that stadium knew was a big win was pretty awesome. Could you see Mangini shaking his man ta-ta’s at the dog pound after a Browns win over the Stillers? Please. I’m tired of seeing fat slobs on the sideline who show no emotion.
Thanks for letting me vent
October 12th, 2009 at 2:35 pm
TD, I’m disappointed. So you’d rather they lose the game? I don’t get it. Isn’t part of football beating the teams you should beat? They certainly should beat Buffalo, if you watched any of the Miami / Buffalo game the week before.
I’m just curious how Anderson skates on a 2-17 outing. Yeah sure, factor in the dropped passes. He still sucked. You can’t have it both ways. If you’re going to talk about how bad this football team is, the blame immediately begins with the offense.
“If he doesn’t fumble the punt deep in his own territory with just under three minutes remaining…”
If the queen had balls, she’d be the queen. If “ifs” and “buts” were candies and nuts, what a wonderful Christmas it would be. And on and on…
As for Denver, I’m not sure if I missed the sarcasm font, but they are actually a pretty good football team, if you have watched them in weeks they didn’t play the Browns. They absolutely stifled New England in the second half yesterday.
I normally agree with your posts, but this one’s a little perplexing.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:38 pm
“If the queen had balls, she’d be the king” is what I obviously meant.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:42 pm
I thought style points were important only in college football. Jeez, what would have you wrote if they lost? Want to cheer up? Go read the Oakland or Buffalo papers.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:47 pm
I’m tired of all the hand wringing over each and every sub-par game by the Browns. We all know this team isn’t going to the Super Bowl, playoffs, or anywhere near .500 this season, but can’t we be a little happy about progress on a week-by-week basis? The first three weeks were dreadful, they played well (yes, actually, objectively well) in week four and almost won, they played bad-offense with good defense and special teams in week five and got a win. This is progress.
Everyone’s attitude on here is why the Browns are in a continual state of rebuilding. Take the long view and give the system a chance to work. In the meantime, enjoy the baby steps and enjoy the FIRST WIN IN 11 MONTHS.
Also, if anyone saw the post-game locker room video over at clevelandbrowns.com, I think the attitude and emotion filling that room after a win gives us a puncher’s shot in Pukesburgh. And if, miracle of miracles, Mangini somehow beats the Steelers, there is an official moratorium on complaining about the Browns for the rest of the year.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:48 pm
TD-well done.
October 12th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Imagine that Isis likes a negative article about the Browns…. SHOCKER!
October 12th, 2009 at 3:02 pm
Sorry Jeremy-just a well thought out honest assessment.
No get back into that bunker, put on your rose-colored glasses, and pour yourself a big glass of kool-aid.
Jeremy-the idea for once is to observe and come up with an original thought-ever tried that approach?
October 12th, 2009 at 3:02 pm
Keep watching Jeremy……observe. Learn.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
“Broncos got rid of his “rocket-armed” qb in Cutler for soft tossing Kyle Orton who threw for over 300yds yesterday against NE…but ball control offense is for losers!! Or undefeated teams.”
Agreed.
JaMarcus Russell has a cannon arm too!
October 12th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
Couldn’t disagree more with the tone of this post. A win is a win, sure, but more importantly, progress is progress.
The Browns have competed in every game but one this season, and had a lot of pressure on them on the road this week to a team and coaching staff that was literally desperate for the win. Additionally, having lost Braylon mid-week left the team no time to both adjust the passing game to make up for the loss of physical talent, and for the receivers that are left to define/earn their new roles with Braylon gone. That’s an easy explanation for all the gripping on the part of the receivers on Sunday, even aside from the 35 mph swirling wind.
The Browns survived anyway, and they survived because they were the better coached team.
What’s the point of complaining about that?
http://www.clevelandfrowns.com/2009/10/eye-of-beholder-browns-6-bills-3.html
October 12th, 2009 at 3:09 pm
I think that the defensive breakdowns/issues that we have experienced are largely attributable to a horrendous offense that does not eat any clock. We have not come close to winning the time of position battle yet, making the defense overworkd. In the end, they get tired make a mistake and the flood gates open up. In Buffalo, we were lucky to face a team with a terrrible rush defense, leading us to be somewhat successful on the ground and eat some time. However, for any average run defense where we have to depend more on the pass attack, we are in deep, deep trouble. It all comes back to the offense – i.e. the Qb and lack of WRs. If we fix that area, other weaknesses benefit as well. In summation, draft a QB next year !!!(LB with second pick).
October 12th, 2009 at 3:09 pm
Man, some Browns fans are the biggest cry babies. We cry when we lose, and we cry when we win. Look, our offense was pathetic before we traded away the only player that demanded attention from the defense. Factor in the weather. What did we expect? The reincarnation of the greatest show on turf? A win is a win. Stop arguing over the quarterback situation, it is a mute point. Arguing for these two stiffs, is like arguing whether a hemorrhoid, or fissure is better. The quarterback of the future is not on this team right now. Hopefully we build around the QB spot before he is here.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:11 pm
I don’t see how anybody can be happy about that win. That was putrid.
If Mangini had any offensive smarts at all, he’d give the QB job back to Quinn. But of course, he doesn’t.
That game was a total embarrassment. A joke. A laughingstock.
If you’re happy with that win, I feel sorry for how far your expectations and standards have fallen.
On an unrelated note, did you see those costumes the Broncos were wearing??? Wow! They made our turd pants look almost acceptable.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:12 pm
I’m baffled. I guess I’m just a true ‘homer’. I couldn’t be happier they won. There was progress made, as Cleveland Frowns pointed out. The special teams was amazing. The defense has played two games very well, back to back. If the offense starts to click, then what? So if we win a game, but looked like a turd doing so, we shouldn’t, as fans, be happy about it? I’m so preplexed. I guess I’ll return to my bunker with my rose colored glasses and big ol’ glass of kool aid.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
Isis – go look up ‘original’ in the dictionary….I am pretty sure you are getting it confused with ‘pessimistic’ or ‘argumentative’
Bad teams need to learn how to win. The Browns won yesterday, that is all that matters. Lets see what the win does for their development into next week.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
Totally agree with #17 – our defense isn’t horrible they just get worn down because the offense can’t stay on the field.
Browns fans need to stop looking for quick fixes. It takes time to build up an organization. We need some consistency.
Baby steps.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:25 pm
To the “A win is a win” people:
Would your attitude be different if we had lost that game 6-3, which was certainly a possibility. A crap-tastic game is still crap-tastic.
- If we had lost, no one would be blaming those “swirling winds” (which is a terrible farce of a weather condition) for our offensive ineptitude.
- If we had lost, people would be calling for DA’s head on a platter after his joke of a performance, instead of blaming it on “drops,” “wind,” or “no Braylon” or stating that he is “1 and 1 as a starter.”
- If we had lost, no one would pretend there was “progress.”
To me, it seems silly to sing the praises of a team that only won a game because it sucked less than the other team. Except for Zastudill, he was beastmode.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:27 pm
Yea MrCleveland we should give the job back to Quinn based on what? Are you in the film room? Are you at every practice? Didn”t think so. So you can base your “expertise” from your living room? Wow, I’m surprised an NFL team hasn’t signed you to a contract. We need to stop acting like we know more than these guys.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:28 pm
@ ben – regardless of whether the Browns won or lost yesterday, their special teams and defense looked good. That is progress
October 12th, 2009 at 3:31 pm
ben, the point is we won, we didn’t lose. So be happy and get ready for next week
October 12th, 2009 at 3:32 pm
Good recap, but absolutely no need to take a shot at Bubby Brister. He would win a QB derby here easily. I mean today, in whatever shape he’s in.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:33 pm
When it rains, it pours…
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4554026
Can someone find me one positive article about the Browns season?
October 12th, 2009 at 3:33 pm
@MacNip: I was being a little over-harsh to make a point. The D looks like it’s slowly coming together, and like I said, Zastudill was a freak.
Am I glad we won’t go 0-16 now? Yeah I am! But like I said, I can’t get excited over being less terrible/pathetic/miserable/superbad than the other team.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:36 pm
#27 FTW.
@ # 23: @Would your attitude be different if we had lost that game 6-3, which was certainly a possibility.
Yes, and if my aunt had ___, she’d be my uncle.
You play to win the game.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:36 pm
@24
Jeremy,
Even Buffalo’s pathetic QB had a better game than Derek Testaverde. A MUCH better game.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:38 pm
Apparently as fans we want the team to play so that we can cry.
BASKETBALL!!
October 12th, 2009 at 3:42 pm
Isis you havent come up with anything original yet. All you do is bash whatever they do. You bash draft picks after their first game. Don’t you know you can’t really grade a draft for a few years. Not you though Isis, bash away. Make sure you copy and paste your original posts too.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:43 pm
He may have had a better game, but did he win? Ask ANYBODY in the NFL what matters most, stats, or wins? I will wait for the response.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
Here’s why this is a great win:
If another game this season sucks this bad, I don’t have to sit it out to see if the Browns are going to be this year’s 0-16 team.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:47 pm
Following the Ravens game two weeks ago, I didn’t think the Browns could win one game this year, so I’m essentially happy about yesterday’s game.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:49 pm
I have never been that depressed after a Browns win.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:49 pm
Isis I am going to go in my bunker, and drink the kool-aid, because I am a Browns fan. I didn’t like the hire of Mangini, but guess what, he is here. Nothing any of us can do. All I can do is sit back, and hope he can turn this thing around. I don’t expect him to turn the mess that is the Browns in a matter of 6-7 months. It takes time Isis. Just like it takes time for draft picks to learn.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:49 pm
I think it was BEAUTIFUL!!! ON TO pittsburgh!!!
October 12th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
LIGHTEN UP PEOPLE!!!
October 12th, 2009 at 3:51 pm
Oh yeah Isis you were so quick to bash Mack, where are you now that he played pretty good yesterday?
October 12th, 2009 at 3:54 pm
@30
There’s more to it than winning (that is especially true when there is no playoff race on the horizon). Some of us require the participants in professional sports to display excellence.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:57 pm
Maybe DA will punch out one of LeBron’s buds at the Bad Goatee Shoppe or somewhere and get shipped to Oakland.
October 12th, 2009 at 3:57 pm
it was fun
October 12th, 2009 at 3:59 pm
@ #42:
So you require your teams to display excellence, especially when they’re not in a position to make the playoffs? Interesting.
My first guess would be that you were probably a big Bulls/Niners/Cowboys/Notre Dame fan in the 90s. Second guess would be that you weren’t old enough to be paying attention back then.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:08 pm
@45:
So you don’t require a sports franchise to show traces of excellence if they’re not in the playoffs hunt?
October 12th, 2009 at 4:13 pm
TD- Spot on Brotha. Great post as always.
I agree almost 100% (sans the D.A. Mulligan…the guy is putrid).
October 12th, 2009 at 4:15 pm
@ #46:
Sure. But there were Brown and Orange ‘traces’ of excellence all over that field yesterday, starting with one of the most excellent special teams performances that I’ve ever seen.
Plato said, “[n]ever discourage anyone who continually makes progress, no matter how slow.”
Anyone who doesn’t see some progress here with Mangini’s Browns probably isn’t worth arguing with.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:23 pm
LOUD NOISES!
October 12th, 2009 at 4:26 pm
As ugly as the win was, it’s still nowhere close to as ugly as an 0-16 season. Detroit would have LOVED to have this pathetic win last year. Just saying…
October 12th, 2009 at 4:32 pm
@45
Excellence is a pre-condition for my getting up about a pro team’s performance. Most pro teams, to me, frequently display excellence, even if they are not play-off contenders – and even if they lose. I think it goes without saying that excellence is supposed to be part of the NFL, MLB, NBA, etc., brand.
As for your guesses: 1) I liked the Cowboys. 2) I’m old enough.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:37 pm
While I certainly am not proud of the performance. I think there are positives to build off of any win. Pittsburgh is not invincible this year. They almost got beat by the lions. Let’s go into Pittsburgh and shock the world.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:37 pm
Does it feel like to anyone else that if we were a playoff contender everyone would be thrilled with a sloppy win because it would mean another step closer to the ultimate goal, but since we’re terrible and have no chance at the playoffs everyone is completely honked off because all we really have this year is “looking good” or “improving” or other subjective results like that?
Just my perspective, feels like all us Cleveland fans are getting hung up on stupidity. We won. It wasn’t pretty (in fact it was very, very ugly), but it’s a win. Let’s try to enjoy it at least a tiny bit and move on.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:38 pm
@ #51 – Nowhere in those acronyms is the letter ‘E’ for excellence.
If it was in there, it’d stand for Expensive, Egregious, or E! like the E! channel. You know – E!
October 12th, 2009 at 4:42 pm
@54
Yes, but the pronunciation of the acronyms, En Ef El, En bEE A, Em El bEE, lean heavily on E.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:43 pm
lol I think I’m going to refer to the leagues in that format every now and again.
Also, e is the natural number.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:45 pm
@ 50- Agreed.
It was ugly and painful to watch, but if they had lost that game imagine how bad you would feel. I know it wasn’t good, but I do take solace in the win. Now, I felt better last week about the state of the Browns then I do now, because the O was bad, but I do think a mulligan is in order. Robiskie had a quote saying the ball was moving up and down as it was in the air. DA had a bad game, but he had a lot of passes on targets, and a lot of passes that should have been caught.
Lets bring on Pittsburgh, Im feeling ready for a fight… i think.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:47 pm
@ #51:
Man points to Matt #2 for admitting it re: the Cowboys. I’m willing to let the rest sit.
I’m off to the Q. Enjoy Monbray Night Football, everyone.
October 12th, 2009 at 4:58 pm
An interesting point was made by James Walker over on the espn afc north blog. In 2 games DA started the browns avg. 158.5 yards rushing. In Quinns starts it was 71.3 yards. Now, some of that is the opposing D, but a larger portion is the D having to stay back and not stack the line.
October 12th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
You really can’t polish a turd.
October 12th, 2009 at 6:26 pm
The NFL is lame. Put skirts on the qbs. Weak sauce.
October 12th, 2009 at 8:56 pm
Actually DCBucks, the Mythbusters proved you could in fact polish certain turds. 2008 season, November 12th episode.
October 12th, 2009 at 9:11 pm
Braylon just made his most impressive catch of the season
October 12th, 2009 at 11:00 pm
He just had a ridiculous catch. Im cheering for him though, because if Braylon does good, the Browns get a rd. 2… so go BE!
October 12th, 2009 at 11:00 pm
Braylon always makes the difficult catches. It’s the easy ones that he drops. Let the guy catch 100 passes, that just gives us a better draft pick
October 12th, 2009 at 11:03 pm
Braylon is good. We made a poop. Too bad it didn’t work out.
October 12th, 2009 at 11:27 pm
There’s a drop! Good job.
October 13th, 2009 at 12:35 am
@64- I would rather rinse my eyes in clorox than cheer for braylon, regardless of what it nets us. His selective effort cost us much more than the potential of a future #2 ever could.
Also, I read that James Davis article, has anyone else noticed D Jackson’s Carlton Banks esque response to every accusation against Mangini since his arrival? Either he’s buyin into the team concept something fierce or he’s hangin from whatever Mangini’s danglin for his starter slot… but I digress
October 13th, 2009 at 12:41 am
oh- forgot to make my main point-
The eN eFF eL is a business. Regardless of how a movie turns out, it’s not gonna gross $50 Million a weekend if the means don’t justify the ends. The product is painfully awful, and as I haven’t had any of the sacrament in me, I’m doing my best to keep my emotions in check about it. Objectively, we shouldn’t be funding this team’s continually putrid performances, looking for small victories or big ones. But that’s the plight of the fan.
I’ll see you boys at the bar on sunday and on the pound for GB!
October 13th, 2009 at 2:10 am
nice catches, bray. your team lost. per usual. for what it’s worth.
October 13th, 2009 at 7:26 am
I have never in my life seen so many babies that call themselves grown men. We won, it was ugly. GET OVER IT. I can only imagine what would have happened if we lost. You so called BROWNS FANS need to look yourself in the mirrors, are you really fans? Or do you just like to blast everything about this team to make yourself feel better? I for one, am happy we won a game. Sure we need a lot of improvement, but for gods sake it was a WIN.
Oh, yea this comment was about the stupdiest thing I’ve read in a long time TD “I am 100% positive this game would have been a 3-3 tie.”
I am 100% positive you are a complete idiot.
October 13th, 2009 at 8:53 am
FOR THE SAKE OF MULTIPLE GODS!!!!
October 13th, 2009 at 9:05 am
My wife asked me before the game what I thought would happen, and my reply was “these teams are so bad, it’s going to be a 3-3 tie or something.”
For a good while, I was unfortunately thinking I was gonna be right.
To me, it looked like Cleveland dictated everything. Their defense dictated what Buffalo could do. Their special teams dictated everything. And their offense was so horrible that Buffalo didn’t need to dictate anything.
October 13th, 2009 at 10:44 am
Have patience, It takes time to rebuild ??? What the heck have we been doing for the past 10 years ??
Of course the special teams (Punter) has improved, He’s on the field all the time because our Offense is pathetic.
This is Cleveland, the city that celebrates that garbage play in buffalo this week as a Win. Then again, these are the same people that voted for Frank Jackson as mayor, and will vote him in agian. No wonder the city is the laughing stock of the nation.
October 17th, 2009 at 10:36 am
[...] it “a win” if you want, at least the brutal affair against the the Buffalo Bills last week enabled Cleveland [...]